You are correct. I have a RMA. I also have good eyes and ability to read. Too many complaints by people waiting for refund, or feedback on the device they sent back to Puri for repair and was a battle to get results. Some haven’t heard back yet after waiting too long IMO.
My bet is the modem is too old, and one can only make firmware updates just so many times before it can’t do what tech is doing to us from the other side. IMO of course.
~s
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I have a RMA sent to me in email April 19, 2024 @ 12:59 PM PDT. I also read where others have done the same and were, according to their author/s, lost in the binary bit byter.
~
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It is up to you if you want to utilize the RMA number and SRF so Purism can address your Librem 5 issues.
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I explained why it’s not a good idea to send things back to Puri. The reason is due to the poor reputation they have, everywhere I look.
Everything points to there being ancient hardware in this - this - thing. But no one can tell me, or are afraid to, just how old the modem really is.
Sending it back is like throwing it into the sea.
I’d wager that if I bought the $599.00 one right no, it would work 99% better than this, and be compatible with more carriers.
The ad says
A Security and Privacy Focused Phone
Yup. Secure and private. So is the latest Apple leash and Google’s spyphone if one turned it off and set it in their desk drawer and forgot about it. I could be wrong, but I think that’s what is meant.
The ad says:
This phone was made with you in mind
Oh come on! No it wasn’t. It was made for profit and I never came into the picture.
The ad says:
…we will continue to provide security updates, privacy improvements, bug fixes, and new features… for the lifetime of your device, without compromising performance.
Well, the “lifetime” of mine is when I received it 15 months ago. IMO: Impossible to do without $upgrading$ hardware at some point.
and, again the ad says:
Vote with your wallet to support a future safe from digital exploitation and create a secure and respectful environment for you, your children and society as a whole.
I already voted with my wallet, and tossed in 15 months of grief and like many people, won’t live long enough to be part that “future”. I am …“safe from digital exploitation” with the L5. Kill switches off (mobile, wi-fi and camera off), L5 powered off - that’s safe alright.
The ad says:
Real Convergence
Are waiting for that “future” to happen? As it is, PuriOS doesn’t even recognize the docker that Puri sells!
I could go on but this post won’t be around for very long. The tabloid-style of adverting will be around though.
Caveat Emptor!
~s
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I fully understand that but… I just sent my second L5 in to get repaired. I had to remind support that it was there but they are currently working on it and I trust that it will come back to me fully repaired.
Edit: and it will be cheaper than buying a new one
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In one of my previous messages I pointed Sharon to the option for sending in the phone for repair. I also pointed her to my positive experiences with sending in the phone for repair.
She has her doubts of doing so. I guess that’s what we call in the EU ‘cold water fear’.
EDIT:
At the monent your phone isn’t working and you are unable to get it working.
Right? So what do you have to loose?
A non-working phone catching dust or sending in the phone you fear you might loose (and I’m confident that such scenario is most unlikely)?
We all here are trying to help, but we faill. I think it’s time to try something else like using the RMA.
But that is completely uip to you.
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I had my doubts like you when I sent my phone back for a second time to Purism (because of my flaky modem issue), but they made good on the whole process by replacing my phone because it was delivered (according to USPS) but they never found it on their end. They replaced my phone no questions asked.
@JCS advocated for me and everything went smoothly with his assistance. I would suggest you do the same, you might be surprised with the result. Like others have said, if your phone isn’t working what do you have to lose?
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Based on other stories here and elsewhere I might never see the phone, have to constantly nag for a ETA, the added costs plus for me, it already cost $1,500,.00 - for a game that was “free”. In short, Yes, I might get the device back, but it may be obsolete by then.
Maybe, the positive comments here had phones with easy fix issues and under warranty.
When I found out that that there is a another ‘support’, warranty was shot.
I’m told that if the issue is software, the costs might be free to flash the phone. A real insult.
But, if it’s hardware related, it would cost me more. So if they have the phone and want money to repair and I disagree, I pay to get it shipped back as a paperweight or they use it for parts.
What have I got to lose? 15 months of trial and error grief, $1,500.00, plus more ridiculous shipping fees that may end being wasted anyway.
I think cell makers should be mandated to use cookie-cutter replacements when consumer attempts to fix it fail. I followed all the instructions *but one. Some instructions were incorrect, but fixed leading to multiple flashing.
I did my part, and then some. Trust is earned. So is a reputation; good, or bad.
~s
- to boot from a USB with installer. That, I might get done today.
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For me, my repairs cost five hundred and they had to replace the screen, the usb board, and the main board… everything but the frame and the radios. Yours shouldn’t be terrible
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Another hundred and you could buy a new one. Were you advised ahead of time what it would cost? Or to get it back? If you said No after knowing…!
It’s a roll of the dice what the costs will be. If I had any, I’d say they got us by the — cops at the door, gotta go by… 
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Yes I was and I chose to go with the costs
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Odd. I asked what it might cost plus if I kept the battery, and they put a new one in (for safe shipping and having a spare), approximate cost after redoing the kernel and flashing the OS
All I got was cursory lip service on a generic cut & paste with no answers to the questions.
People asking where their refund is, where their device is, and their ads and online reviews (sans their own self-reviews) has me believe they can and will get away with not answering when they don’t feel like it.
A lot of places ask for reviews. Those I’ve seen are negative. They keep adding up.
From a purely business point of view, their service or lack of it, unfulfilled promises, bad reviews, staff leaving and ads that over-rate their product says they won’t be around for long. They need pro’s to get it going and living up to their ads and promises.
Ghosting customers seeking help is a poor way to do business. And will catch up with them. I hope soon before others are dumped on the side of the road.
ted
by Purism
@JCS @joao.azevedo @joao.azevedo
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If it works for you, it works for you - but obviously a lot of customers are having my issue.
What percentage of non-working laptops with no support replies is acceptable?
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0%. Anything else a joke.
The most frustrating thing about this situation is that, for some unknown, unspoken reason, Purism can’t just come out and be straight with everyone. If they would just publicly say something, it would go a long way towards rebuilding the trust that they’ve totally trashed through their actions (and inaction). Something truthful such as:
Hey folks, we are almost out of money, so we can barely afford to pay anyone at the moment. We apologize and we plan to do better. Meanwhile, we do have enough money to keep the forums hosted, so you can help each other out (and we can jump in at times when we make a sale).
Let’s be happy that at least these forums still work, because if they didn’t we’d all be even more in the dark than we already are.
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The support department has historically been placed in impossible situations in which they
- are not allowed to discuss issues that escalate to legal threats
- Purism has responded by resolving legal matters through legal channels
- are only provided financial approval for refunds based on cash availability and queue prioritization
- Purism is responding by earmarking funds in their budget for gradual refund disbursement
- Purism is responding by, once cash allows, holding incoming funds in escrow until the order ships
- are not provided developer resources (for sake of argument, let’s consider developers as “tier-3 support”) in a timely manner with which to discuss complex troubleshooting
- Purism is responding by allowing support staff to ping relevant developers, where the developer may charge time to the support ticket
- do not have adequate time to construct improved infrastructure (a client ticketing front-end, for example) to elegantly process customer support issues while simultaneously processing the ticket backlog
- Purism is responding by hiring additional support staff
- Purism is responding by actively researching and implementing workflow and tooling improvements
- have been publicly doxxed, berated, and humiliated as a result of the refund fiasco
- Purism has responded by offering staff the option to anonymize their names or operating simply as “Purism Support”
- Purism has responded by offering the option to escalate difficult cases to management
- Purism is responding by working toward resolution with customers so that it never gets to this point (this is a work in progress and likely will be for a while)
- have been issued death threats in graphic detail
- Purism has responded by suggesting the option to inform law enforcement
- Purism is responding by reviewing company policy and taking actionable steps to better protect staff (in progress)
In general, support could use some grace here because in some circumstances they are not approved to say “yes” to the customer but also cannot say “no,” so the alternative is for them to say nothing. It is up to management to provide adequate resources to support in order for support to adequately do their jobs.
All of your (speaking generally to the community here) criticisms are valid. You know this. Purism knows this. And Purism is doing everything it can to do better and stay that way. It may just take some time to adjust course.
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Honestly, it sounds like Purism should go out of business. And this is based on your post which is defending Purism.
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Sure, you are certainly entitled to that opinion. It was requested that Purism be open and transparent, so that’s how I responded. If I omit accountability or actionable responses from Purism, people would state that I am making excuses on their behalf; if I include actionable responses, I risk communicating defensiveness on their behalf. These are all real concerns that are actively being addressed. In my opinion, the risk of judgement is worth the assurance that you’re not getting a sales pitch. In my opinion, this is what Purism needs to do to re-earn public trust.
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We wouldn’t want the criminals and those exhibiting subcriminal behaviour to win - noting that Purism support are having to deal with death threats and abuse.
(Edited to make clear what it was responding to and to avoid controversial language.)
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Which criminals? What are you talking about?
Which shills? I haven’t seen any shills. Are you engaging in name-calling or just being vague to such an extent that it was pointless to comment?
For ease of conversation, “shill” is defined as:
shill (noun) = an accomplice of a hawker, gambler, or swindler who acts as an enthusiastic customer to entice or encourage others in the swindle.
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Are there estimates on when the refund queue will be fully resolved? e.g. Are we talking 6 months, 12 months, 18 months, or “a very very long time”???
AFAIK most companies don’t charge the credit cards until shipping has started — no need for escrow.
Purism has responded by offering the option to escalate difficult cases to management
I noticed Todd directly approved a refund when someone complained about their “defied refund” on the StartEngine page. IMO, in that conversation Todd pretended to not know that there were quite a few orders that were made with a “full refund on request” or “full refund when you are at the head of the shipping queue”. In your opinion is Todd aware that he is denying refunds to many others in that same situation?
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