I must have very long finger to use
You will be getting used to use the shift button on the left
Unfortunately, this is not the same. If the user works with the keyboard blindly with ten fingers, the letter key and the shift key should be pressed simultaneously with different hands. Although, I think, the user can adapt to such a strange location of the shift key, if all the time working blindly on this laptop.
I think the only time I’ve ever used the right shift is because the program or game I was using/playing required it.
I can sympathize for some who do use it regularly but for me and I imagine many others this an absolute non-starter.
As an Asian programmer here. I normally use combination of both
With that position I must use one another keyboard which is ridiculous. How can I claim this is ergonomic cool Linux laptop!
You mean as in non-issue?
It certainly is further away than usual. However the previous response is correct. You are supposed to use the shift key on the opposite side of the keyboard from the letter in question (and with the other hand).
Possibly you could remap in order to use right-alt instead of right-shift, or are you using right-alt frequently already?
I meant that to say that I see it as an acceptable compromise. I would think if such a thing were so critical you would just bring your own keyboard with. I know many people who swear by their particular keyboard and wont use anything else.
I just think the premise of this thread is a bit ridicules. A key not very used in the western world isn’t a joke because in Asia the key is used. These are just difference we have, and they can sometimes make the logistics of these things difficult.
Hopefully there will be enough interest and region specific keyboards can be offered.
As has been stated elsewhere on the forums, previous attempts to offer other keyboard layouts on previous Librem laptops didn’t have enough orders to justify the cost of offering those extra variants. It’s clear that Purism’s primary customers (as in, those actually spending the money to buy hardware) prefer US keyboard layouts, and I do think the use of the right shift key is quite uncommon in English. I think I only ever use it to type “?”, and I’d definitely take the full-sized arrow keys in exchange.
"It is clear that Purism s primary customers are from the US " ??? Ok, this point might not be shared by neither some Purism staff nor a certain number of users in this forum Give me a “heart” when you agree with me
I think, in particular from the US-point of view, people should have a more global approach for Linux and a local approach for keyboards. And this does not only concern IT topics (this is not a political post
It’s not so strange that the majority of the customers are from the US, if they don’t provide other keyboard layouts. That’s another way to look at it. I am very much a potential buyer, but I have held since they don’t offer Swedish keyboard layout.
Actually @taylor-williamc didn’t say that. He said that the “customers prefer US keyboard”.
Regardless, the financial reality, for a laptop where the keyboard is integrated within the device, is likely that there isn’t sufficient demand for alternative keyboards.
It would be nice though if the keyboard were modular and could be directly unscrewed from the top and replaced - or something like that.
That’s a fair point, but they did offer UK and German layouts for some time, and those did not sell well enough to justify their continued production. While I don’t have any data, I would find it surprising if a Swedish/Scandinavian layout sold better than German layouts.
They do still offer refurbished laptops with those layouts:
You are right, he said “prefer”. That is still his personal opinion and I am not sure that the majority of customers prefers it. And I am not sure that all English writers ignore the right shift key. Finally, it is Purism s choice and I hope it was the right one commercially.
And I am convinced that “ROW” has at least the same long term potential as the US. Finally, we all want Purism to succeed and I am still waiting for the phone. And for an acceptable price. 800$ plus exchange rate + taxes. That is my problem.
Most keyboards have the bottom row longer (wider) with the up and down arrow keys squished. I wonder who’s their supplier that creates this layout.
I seem to type only using the left shift key and my right pinkie over the enter. My Dell XPS and old Macbook both have the right shift future away than the left shift.
I don’t have an opinion for or against the placement of the right shift.
I used to type with the left shift key almost exclusively until I switched to the Dvorak layout. Now I use whichever shift key is on the opposite side of the letter I’m typing and I think this placement of right shift would be really inconvenient.
It seems like the keyboard should be modular, though, in the sense that it really just needs a rectangle cut out of the lower inside case panel. I’m sure Purism did a cost analysis on this option and decided it wasn’t feasible, but it seems like the particular membrane keyboard that goes into the rectangle (and therefore the keyboard layout) should make a difference of a couple of dollars at most.
I’m in the US, and I use the right-shift key quite a bit. Basically whenever the letter I have to make capital is on the left side (I used the right-shift to type the ‘B’ at the beginning of this sentence).
That said, looking at the picture, it is not that far away. I usually hit the ‘outside’ of the shift key, which is the same distance on my current laptop and on the Librem 14. I think I’d be able to use the Librem 14 keyboard without having to ‘reprogram’ my brain at all
Should the SHIFT key have been placed closer to the letter keys?
I am used to only using the left side SHIFT Key, the one on the right side makes no personal difference for my daily use
I love this keyboard layout
Full sized arrow keys rule.
I did not buy Librem 13 just because it has them squished.
Right shift is tiny indeed, but it is either tiny shift or tiny arrow keys.
I, an EN-US user, put my hands on the keyboard home row and type without looking. Maybe I am “of an age”, but I consider this a minimum qualification for being “civilized”.
I had never looked at a Librem laptop keyboard before, but having now seen one, I can say that I am definitely not a fan. I eagerly await my L5-Evergreen, and if I find myself looking for a computer, I will seriously consider a Librem Mini. I write this on a 10 year old HP running Mint, but when I want to buy a laptop, I’ll probably look to Pine64 or System 76 (I’ll need to scrutinized their keyboards, first).
Having said that, if I had a Librem laptop to play with for a week, I might change my mind. Only my fingers know for sure!