Its a fake Sarcasmo220, cause you can watch (without camera) or Internet Device watching you or a WLAN device which tracking your Body movements… and talk about Online Stuff too, and share or watching movies or read Text without the knowledge of internet right now. Its not likely for 99%, just they do not know about it… but it is possible.
Or, in other words, if you can’t make it work the way it should work, make it an invite-only club for the connoisseurs.
http://www.fallacydetective.com/news/read/snob-appeal
You’re making a fallacious argument that it’s either “FREEDOM” or usability/accessibility, while in reality those two should not be mutually exclusive.
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Power has many metrics and dimensions. Not all requirements are equal either.
Depending on the context, almost none of us knows what they’re doing most of the time. Please let’s embrace that we’re a diverse bunch with different needs, all of which are valid.
We’re all being consumers, almost 100% of the time.
I’ve made 1k+ contributions to open-source projects in 2023 alone. I’ve contributed code to mainline Linux, like several other forum members have. Yet, I enjoy watching the occasional live stream or movie, which makes me a consumer.
So, is the L5 powerful enough to fit my needs? For most purposes, yes, definitely. Is it enough for daily driving in 2023? Maybe not just yet. There’s still work to do, expectations to manage, and feelings of frustration to cope with.
Yet most EU-based banks don’t allow general-purpose Linux devices as a 2FA device, and aren’t planning to do so anytime soon. Which means you don’t get to do bank transactions unless you also own (and maintain) an unmodified, trusted iOS/Android phone.
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False. I am making the argument that people like you fail to properly acknowledge the demographic that built the free software movement exclusively for their individual needs:
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Exists
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Whose key demographic distinction from the apple and microsoft demographics is that THEY ARE NOT a monolith and instead made up of very very very different individuals that cannot easily be quantified by some simple descriptives.
The free software users demographic is real, they created the free software ecosystem for their needs and it exists EXACTLY as this very large, very smart, very demanding, very exacting, very independent, very unique demographic demands.
It is people LIKE YOU that seek to erase this group of people. It is people like you that seek to demean this group of people and their cultures, life styles and belief systems. It is people LIKE YOU that seek to tell this beautiful and unique demographic that has build this PREMIUM FREEDOM EXPERIENCE that they should not exist, they should not believe what they believe and that they should … SOMEHOW … change and cater to the demographic of users in the apple, android and microsoft camp.
NO.
We aren’t changing. It is YOU that has to change for us. You either change, or you … well you can do what you want actually, we don’t care because your useless presence makes no difference to us.
THIS is the eye watering beauty of this premium freedom ecosystem. Your useless views can completely an utterly ignored without affecting me in any way. And most importantly, VICE VERSA. This is the magic of the premium user experience we all enjoy. Not you, not Purism, not anyone can impose their views on each of us. And I cannot impose my views on you.
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In case you missed my larger point, the free software ecosystem is:
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A PREMIUM freedom ecosystem experience.
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What distinguishes the demographic that defines the premium freedom experience is that it caters TO THE INDIVIDUAL and not the group. It is LITERALLY the single distinguishing feature of the demographic and why no two people can agree on anything anywhere.
Let me give you some examples of the kinds of individuals that the premium free software ecosystem caters to. You feel that bank 2FA is important on Linux, I don’t. I keep on reading that there are EU countries where a smartphone is literally required to access all government services, I spit on those countries and the people that have not only allowed that to happen but have whole heartedly thrown away freedom and individual responsibility in favour of some fake sense of security and safety that no political system can guarantee. And so on.
The point here is that we DO NOT have to agree on anything. We DO NOT have to like each other. We can even be blood enemies in all possible dimensions. And yet, we both belong to the free software movement and ecosystem because it caters to both of us individually and not in some aggregate form. I cannot force you to do anything. You cannot force me to do anything. And, despite all of that, I can still respect all of your contribution even if you are wrong in your assessment, value system and desires.
The free software ecosystem is a premium freedom experience.
It is the ultimate expression of how all of our individual colours can exist and all of our individuals wants and needs can be met.
The problem here is NOT anything that you mention. The problem is that people fail to appreciate the true nature of freedom of the individual from the tyranny of the group. The MOMENT that you lose sight of the freedom of the individual is the moment you erase that individuality for some randomly selected set of values that need to be accommodated. In your case, you select 2FA from banks. In the case of others it is some other random vector of values, each of which seeks to erase the sharp edges of individuality into some homogeneous shapeless whole.
I reject your assessment. I reject your values. I reject you.
And THAT, is the nature of the premium freedom experience. I owe you nothing. You owe me nothing. I cannot make you do anything. You cannot make me do anything. You can keep on yaking about 2FA and I will happily keep ignoring you and perhaps even poisoning the waters so that it never happens. And I do this not only out of glee at not wanting to go along with your nonsense values but because I have seen something magical happen over the last 20 years. While the free software movement is far beyond my years, I have seen the free software movement grow from a small enthusiast niche of ideological extremists to a large tent of individuals whose numbers are large enough now to have allowed companies like System76 and Purism to not only exist but establish a very healthy and (to some degree sizeable) businesses.
I want this demo of people to grow and I want this premium ecosystem to grow its internal economy. And I want everyone to recognise and acknowledge the magical group of people that inhabit this demographic and recognise and acknowledge that an entire ecosystem of tools has been created in service of their individuality and NOT in service of pure profit that seeks to erase that individuality and turn as all into pigs on a corporate trough.
Freedom is a PREMIUM experience.
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I marked your post as a troll and spam.
Some aspects of that trolling:
And spam:
Please revisit the Forum FAQ regarding your conduct. FAQ - Purism community . Especially:
Be Agreeable, Even When You Disagree
You may wish to respond to something by disagreeing with it, and that’s fine. Healthy debate is beneficial to expose alternative viewpoints and avoid operating in an echo chamber. But remember to criticize ideas, not people. Please avoid:
- Name-calling
- Ad hominem attacks
- Responding to a post’s tone instead of its actual content
- Knee-jerk contradiction
Instead, provide reasoned counter-arguments that improve the conversation. Especially when making bold claims or accusations, support your viewpoint with facts, citing references when possible.
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To be fair, among the packages with a GUI, how many of them are adaptive? (so that they are actually usable on the Librem 5 screen). In my opinion, this is a work-in-progress.
The reality is that most Linux users will never use most Linux packages - just as most Android / iPhone users will never use most of the apps that are available in their respective prisons.
To the average user, sheer numbers of apps is not important. What is important is whether the modest number of specific apps that that user wants can actually be used. Hence the griping about banking in the EU (or, in my country, use of specific government apps). My longer term answer for that will be something like Waydroid.
I support what Purism is doing, and open source in general. I am prepared to be patient.
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Absolutely correct! This is just the beginning of our journey. Hopefully we all can pitch and help build out the adaptive interfaces while building out a shared set of tools that respect and enhance all of our freedoms as individuals.
You did not write it, but the implication of your post (and one other persons post) are that most of the tools and resources in our ecosystem either are or might be inaccessible to non-technical users. Absolutely, I agree with that assessment and I am looking to help lower the barrier to entry as well. Obviously, I want to make my user experience nicer first as the first itch that I want to scratch but I hope others can benefit as well.
Phosh was created by Purism team and all things considered, the software alone is very easy to use and I enjoy the experience a lot. I cannot say enough about any group of people that decide to build these kinds of solutions and do it so well.
The takeaway from the my last few posts (I hope) is this: DON’T SELL YOUR SELF AND THE COMMUNITY SHORT.
You are important. You are valuable. Recognise the embarrassment of riches that we all share. Learn to value it. Learn to treasure it. Push your self and the community to look at all that has been accomplished, some by accident and some by design, and marvel at it all. Entire industries run on top of what the free software movement has built, industries that feed and clothe families and whose growth will feed and clothe more and more families around the globe.
I see a lot of negative framing on these forums and my goal is put a giant weight on the other end of the scale to help people see that those that pursue this negative frame are mistaken, and perhaps more. The correct frame, the frame that makes you appreciate every morning is being thankful for everything around us, the sharp edges, the warts and all. And wherever you see these people pushing these negative frames, it is important to stand up and hold a mirror to their frame and provide an alternate frame so that we don’t forget just how good we have it.
I agree with you.
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Sarcasm, hyperbole and pointed humor are reasoned responses. Why would you assume his post is anything more? Assuming the worst in people – especially those you disagree with – is no way to be “agreeable”. Neither is hiding someone’s post, then extensively quoting them.
Freedom is why we are here and we buy Purism products, but it extends beyond tech and software to everything that makes us human.
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Because it isn’t humor, sarcasm, or hyperbole. They frequently personally attack the person they are replying to. Their post is obviously a violation of the forum code of conduct. A hint is how frequently they say “people like you” … it always precedes a tribal and personal attack.
And apparently they replied to me and it was flagged as inappropriate too. I can’t see it, but I’ve interacted with them before and trust that it was also a toxic response.
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I appreciate the vote of support, if that is not be assuming too much. My assessment of my comments is in line with your post here, hyperbole + pointed humour.
Text doesn’t translate well sometimes, but then again, we seem to have what we call in American culture “hall monitors” and “tattle tales” around here. Whenever their feelings get hurt they run to the teacher.
I think this conversation about moderation is more important than the usual take which is, it’s the internet it doesn’t matter. In this case, it really does matter. It mattes a lot, because these are the kinds of people driving our communities, and dare I point to, our western nations into the ground.
Without going into my big picture assessment, the goal of my communication was as follows:
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There are users on this board and in our communities framing all of us and all of our work in very negative frames. They are not entirely incorrect, but they are skewing the general perception of “our communities self image” into a place I do not want to see it go.
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Each time one of the users posted a negative frame, it was framed in a way that positioned their negative frame as the only possible interpretation and excluded everyone elses potential perspectives.
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My goal was to put a giant counterweight to their frame and provide a positive frame. I provided perspectives, contexts and ways to think about how we ought to value our selves that makes us (in my opinion) richer and stronger.
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In addition, my positive frame not only emphasised my positive frame, it included everyone elses potential perspectives including that of the person posting the negative frame.
In other words, I am an expert in many more dimensions than the typical poster of a negative frame and my handling of their perspective was not only a deft counterweight, it includes all of the usual syntactic narrative sugar to drive a point home. As a side point, to address the tone of this paragraph, it is okay to know your strengths, lean into them and declare them to the world. It forces you to claim your position in the hierarchy and live or die by it. Your humility will be displayed in how you handle your eventual failure.
Back to the topic, ultimately, the psychology of a group is highly dependent on having at least a few members capable of recognising when these negative frames get inserted and knowing how to deal with them.
But, none of that is a problem, all of the above is to describe the mechanics of what was actually happening in the discussion versus what is perceived by someone like Privacy2.
I would propose an alternate interpretation here. The true source of toxicity in a community is people like Privacy2, not because they are utterly incapable to understand, but BECAUSE THEY WANT TO NANNY THE COMMUNITY ON BEHALF OF THE COMMUNITY.
The last point is the important point. I don’t care about his opinions (and no one should care about mine, frankly), that isn’t the issue. Hiding my posts is not the issue either. If I believe that I have done something wrong, I will even apologise. What is of great importance is when a community allows a person like that to nanny the community on behalf of the community … to … what? Protect the community from it self?
Here is a novel thought: How about you let adults judge for them selves? They are not children to be cooed and coddled. And who are you to decide on behalf of anyone else anyway?
In a way, I am glad that he decided to do what he did, it shows him for who he really is. It also shines a light on what all of us must become good at: strength of self (being able to separate your self from any critique), strength to speak (standing to others and providing counter balance) and strength to fight for freedom.
This specific example is PRECISELY the exact mechanic that all of our rights are getting eroded in our western civilisations and it is important to fight for those rights. And how do you fight for those rights?
Simple: You fight for your right to speak by fighting for your enemies right to speak. Your enemy may not respect it but you end up controlling the moral high ground which is social proof members in a human social group look for.
To wit, anyone here in the community is given permission to say anything they want to me, in any manner they wish, using any words they wish. Be as rude as you want. Your posts will never be hidden. To anyone moderating, you do not have my permission to moderate on my behalf.
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Maybe some Server-based-Waydroid (to solve the Energy issue) which will only share pictures, streams or important information as the resulted of the interaction with respect of privacy. And as Arguments to run that application you have to add some Attributes, like position, User-ID and so on. This could bake down the marked to a important shift to privacy, but will never rise up, cause the Data is what runs the energy wheel not the wanted (by user) Information, Service and so on. Its like Webpages with Tor-Browsers and Addblocker, for Companies who try to give away information not for free. On the other side i hope we will put some or more money over for not being information-slaughtered. There is no easy answer still, and its an ongoing fight.
To you Quote, The Long answer is, that there is no future for Librem5 nor Android and Iphone. We will see a Shift in near future where neural Data will be collected by earplugs or hair circlets and stimulate impressions to the brain as down link, like you have a conversation to your self and or a phone call of thoughts and notes by others. Not sure if a synthetic AI, or a self trained one will be the way how you interact with computers - but this is the way we will go for it for sure in 2040.
Hope for us Nerds that our Librem 5 or 6 will still exist and supported and i think that we are in that future some Grandparents which use a the good old energy hungry hardware.
However, Linux and free Software will be excellent in that time because that is what the community can do at its best. On every Windows Computer there will be a faster running up to Date Linux System in the future with more and the best software. So it will rush on the Phones for sure. Hope that the A.I. Impact plus Community control can rush the software created for Smartphones without loosing privacy.
Loved to see what purism and the Linux Community had done in the last 12 Month, its a nice looking forward to the next stabilized breach.
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Definitely. Wasn’t going to run it on my phone.
In order to operate a free device, you need a free place within which to run it. The general internet is a place full of predators. Too many of those predators are large corporate entities. Someone needs to start a separate internet space that automatically detects and routinely blocks and disables the predators. Perhaps a first violation of either privacy or advertising might result in a pc being kicked out of the entire space. To get re-admitted, the pc owner may have to agree to Terms of Service that restricts their behavior. Big companies like Google and Microsoft could be forced to behave themselves while in that space, no snooping, tracking, nor advertising, or else out they go.
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That’s one model.
A different model is one where predators are by law forced to respect one regular internet user’s choice not to be preyed upon.
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I’m using FF for online-banking on Librem5. 2FA is done via bank cart and TAN-device. It has even more benefits: You can’t use your phone for transactions AND 2FA. Transaction-device has to be something different than 2nd-factor-device. So this way is one of the few ways to do mobile banking which is accepted by banks.
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Hi, I saw you use public transportation and in that case I can whole-heartedly recommend
Public Transport - for timetables, routing, … and
Railway for the same information on Bundesbahn connections.
Both work flawlessly.
Online Tickets? I personally don’t use public ticketing apps because they also are just trackers.
Train tickets that you buy online and show up in “official” apps like the DB-Navigator are simultaneously available online on your DB account. For this I would suggest a web-app via “Web” app. or downloading the pdf? Yeah, not really super shiny, but …
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I have a Deutschlandticket from DB, which is neither visible nor downloadable from my DB account.
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Have you tried Waydroid? I haven’t run it on Librem 5 but it was working well on my linux laptop.
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