I originally sent my request to a Purism employee that somebody suggested I chat with regarding this situation. Due to the lack of response from Mr. Saenz I went ahead and looped in support@puri.sm. If there is a better choice, please advise.
Let’s review. You seem to believe the following things:
- I am a narcissist.
- Calling out lies told by Purism is wrong.
- Asking questions about the hardware production process is wrong.
- Asking questions about Purism’s financial situation is wrong.
- Expecting Purism to be accountable to their customers is wrong.
- Implying Purism might have financial problems is wrong.
- Purism not giving me a refund is perfectly fine because I am a bad person.
Let me just say that I am so glad I don’t live in a world of your making. I sincerely hope that you find an avatar that doesn’t fall short of your expectations one day because honey I am quite sure Purism ain’t it.
Have a great life,
Jay
The software isn’t the problem here. Most of the great things you posted are software related. The hardware is the problem and Purism has gone out of its way for quite awhile now to NOT speak of the hardware. When they do its usually vague. But hey I was fine with that. It was a work in progress. The shipping snafu was the straw that broke the camels back for me.
As for implying that Purism might be having financial problems being so offensive. I have literally asked them in the form of a simple to address yes/no question to address that directly. They have made the choice to ignore my questions and the questions asked by numerous other members of the community. They are choosing not to simply tell us “No we aren’t waiting on future sales to finance the completion of existing orders”
I even removed that question from my original list when I reposted them in Lundukes “let’s rehash a bunch of stuff everybody already knows so we can shut most people up” thread. And you know what? It seems to have worked. Maybe he is better at marketing than I thought.
In any event I have given Purism multiple opportunities to address our concerns with some carefully designed questions. They have refused to provide even a single answer.
I could go on but I won’t. I am tired of wasting my time here.
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Yes, I think you are in the wrong place. I do not know about others but I have been working on research and development projects for 35 years and I know that it is impossible to give absolute timetables. All timetables must be seen as indicative. Thus I have no complaints whatsoever against Purism and I think they should be allowed to work in peace. Why not wait for a year and when there are reviews and stable products have another look at the phone. I do not want the Purism people to start informing so much instead of concentrating on the development work. I think information has been quite enough and more details will emerge in a few months time. The ultimate answers will be given only when I have the phone in my own hands and I can wait several months (even if I would like to have it as soon as possible).
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See:
https://www.spinics.net/lists/arm-kernel/msg750923.html
(file: arch/arm64/boot/dts/freescale/imx8mq-librem5-phone.dts)
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For the latest changes in the device tree files, watch this directory:
https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/linux-next/tree/imx8-linux-next-librem5/arch/arm64/boot/dts/freescale
Specifically see the imx8mq-librem5.dts and imx8mq-librem5-devkit.dts files:
https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/linux-next/blob/imx8-linux-next-librem5/arch/arm64/boot/dts/freescale/imx8mq-librem5.dts
https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/linux-next/blob/imx8-linux-next-librem5/arch/arm64/boot/dts/freescale/imx8mq-librem5-devkit.dts
The software is not relevant. The hardware is the vaporware here.
I welcome a critical discussion at any point in time for any given project. However, I would appreciate it if you could substantiate your claims with sources so as to enable the rest of us to prove your arguments (which holds both for supporters and critics). I follow the news section of puri.sm and only some conversation here, so I am not always 100% up to date.
To just give you one example: You claim that purism is straight out lying about their Librem 5 endevor. Could you specify that? Which statement gives you the impression of a malicious, intentionally dishonest statement?
If you have posted them already somewhere I might have missed that. I have read quite a lot of your statements by now but not claiming I have read all of them. Thank you very much. 
In one of your postings you write that a proof of an actual phone call from Librem 5 to another phone would be needed to show that the phone is working. Isn’t the calling function a software issue? How can you then claim that the software is not relevant?
When you were presented with new pictures about hardware (e.g. Todd Weaver posting a new picture 1-2 days ago) you claimed something similar along the lines that hardware is not relevant but the software, i.e., that the phone is capable of making phone calls.
Those are my observations.
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Scroll up to the first post of the thread and read. Simple as that.
Jay,
What exactly do you need to know about the Librem 5’s hardware?
At this point, we know virtually every chip and the PCB layout in Librem 5, except for the image sensors being used for the front and back cameras and how Purism plans to provide video out. At this point, the major issue is getting the software to work with the hardware in the phone.
I agree with you that Purism could have given more info about its development, but Purism has given us a clear window when the first batch should ship, and I think that we shouldn’t jump to premature conclusions, without giving Purism the time to fulfill what it said it would do.
I also have worked on software and hardware projects that got delayed. The company that I work at is 8 months behind in rolling out the next version of its software. I know what the issues are, but I can’t say anything on the software’s forum, so users are complaining and wondering if the next version will ever arrive.
Purism released its Dev Kit files under the GPL3.0+ license. We can see the source code being developed in the Purism repository, which is the most important part at this point. I don’t understand why people are assuming that Purism won’t be shipping the Aspen batch of the Librem 5, when all we have to do is wait 3 more weeks to find out.
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Read the first post. My list of questions remain unchanged as they all remain unanswered. I guess I can add an 8th one though:
- Where can I get a copy of the annual report SPCs like Purism in California are required to post on their website?
I have read your first post. There you are stating questions and suppositions.
Not one of your questions have been answered.
How come that you draw (from your unanswered questions?) the conclusion that purism is lying? To me it’s a big difference if someone is not answering a question and lying. Both can be done intentionally and (rather) unintentionally, but the difference is quite stark.
If you care to comment I would like your opinion on what I have posted above:
You seem to be contradicting yourself. Either it is absolutely clear what you want which is nothing good or it is not clear what you want because you yourself don’t know it.
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Minor correction? Purism appears to be registered in the US state of Washington. I’m not going to pretend that I am at all familiar with US law, so whether it makes a difference I do not know.
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It doesn’t matter what the specifics are for each State. The point is that he is full blown attack seeing things through this extremely negative lens.
Everything is to be “exposed” as a fraud or sheme . Going after every tiny word. In this case he confused something of actual meaning with Marketing schtick. Instead admitting that, he goes into finding yet another mistep by this company.
Doom and gloom approach, like with most conspiracy theorists.
I’m really surprised how patient are the moderators here.
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Entitlement issues. I did this therefore I demand X in return. As if they signed some contract with him and not complying with it.
So, let’s come up with a whole bunch of Qs and demand answers or else.
If you are disappointed for whatever reason with your “investment”, feel free to disengage and pull your funds out.
No reason to fall into this manic tirade for this long.
Wanna warn people about possible wrongdoing leading to the loss of their investment? You do it - as Purism graciously allowed you. And be done with it. But, no. Not enough. Has to keep going on and on.
Beyond ridiculous at this point.
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It would be good if all of the “where’s my phone already, dude?” topics could be combined into one topic and moved to the Whinge Lounge category.
One thing is abundantly clear, after hundreds of posts in multiple topics … no new information has emerged from Purism. So without real information it is speculation v. speculation.
I get that people are impatient, but it all seems to be pointless.
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@jaylittle has shown himself to be an obvious troll at this point. While I’ll admit that I get a chuckle from some of his antics, it’s more sad than funny to me at this point:
- Pretending to be a seasoned sage of an “investor” who is just doing us an invaluable service of pointing out that this whole Librem 5 thing is a total scam because they don’t come onto the forums and answer his endless questions (bordering on a Gish Gallop that Purism would be stupid to engage with anyway).
- Pretending the rest of us don’t already all know this is a risky project that could get delayed further or could still fail - pretty sure most of us here are not wide-eyed infants, unschooled in the ways of the world.
- Pretending that the absence of evidence is evidence of absence. etc etc.
If he came on here and started asking Librem 5 pre-order customers to pressure Purism directly to communicate more frequently and clearly, taking a cue from the Pine Phone project (maybe we should do that, BTW), and engaged in reasonable discussions about the risk of the project being delayed further or failing, the merits of voting with your money to support something else instead, etc. then there would have been reason to believe him. Sadly, with his blatant jumping to unsupported conclusions, fear mongering, and condescension he’s pretty clearly a troll (and not a very good one at that).
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Purism has not yet broken any of its commitments and it’s still possible for them to fulfill as agreed. I am unhappy with how they have communicated. But they deserve an opportunity to fulfill without anyone making unproven claims against them. Maybe there are legitimate reasons for why we can’t fully informed (maybe). I am in the baby boomer generation. We have traditional business expectations. Then again, you get a different perspective when you read ‘The Cathedral and the Bazaar’. Microsoft and Google are the cathedral. Everything Linux is the Bazaar. I also credit Todd for his recent post, showing what the Aspen batch looks like. That helps, even if I still expect more.
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Based in Washington? Feel free to provide some supporting information. Here is what Purism says on their own FAQ Page
Q: Where is Purism based?
A: Short answer: South San Francisco, CA USA
Longer answer: Worldwide. Purism sources component parts from China, Taiwan, Japan, and the United States. Purism builds, assembles, quality control tests, and delivers all our hardware from our South San Francisco facility, USA. Purism has employees, contractors, and volunteers from around the world.
I find it really sad that every time I try to take the company at their word, I’m told that I’m a troll, an idiot or something else along those lines. Yet the very reason I’m here is to try and keep you from taking what Purism is saying to you at face value. If you can prove that they are registered out of Washington state (and yes it absolutely makes a difference), then that is yet another instance of them lying as their own FAQ page states that they are clearly based out of California.
But hey, Apple does the same thing so they can enjoy their Irish tax loopholes, right? LOL. Of course they do. But the entire point of Purism and what they are supposed to be doing is that they were supposed to be a step above the competition.
You know? This is dumb. You guys clearly don’t want to hear it and I’m tired beyond all measure of pushing it.
I’m out. Peace out.
/me drops the mic