The Need For Clear Communications From Purism


I wasn’t aware that ordering now gets evergreen. Your comment acknowledged and my commended amended accordingly.


But at the end of the day maybe this, maybe that, maybe everything is going to be good, maybe lots have shipped, maybe maybe maybe…just like you say, “we’ll see”.

That’s just it.

The lack of communication is a very significant part of the dishonesty.


I am so disillusioned now :slight_smile:

It would be fun to find out where everyone’s name came from.

“Leetaur” is a fantasy character I made up in 1993, when I was writing a story. He’s made a few appearances in stories since.


Cutouts for some sort of the mold through which antenna - signal would go through.


Cool :slight_smile: I must admit though I don’t read fantasy :frowning: (nothing against it, I just have a weird reaction to it)


I’ve been a critic of their communication since I joined two years ago.
But I think what we currently see is rather crunch time.

The things they stated in the shipping announcement seem to be outdated already. By that I don’t mean the delay, but the case quality upgrade. And that is something they couldn’t have communicated in advance.
You know, like
“Ok, one week delay, but better quality. Pinky promise. Oh, wait. Some more days. But really exciting quality!”

That would not have worked well.
When things are progressing and changing quickly, is sometimes better to communicate it later, when it’s definite and no longer subject to change. I hope we’ll get a blog post next week.


in native Indian-American that would bring a twist to the tongue …


if anything they’ve said a little too much if you ask me …


But in the end, deep down, we’re all middle-aged goats right? :wink:

I have big respect for the people who are sorting all that out. Actually I have great respect for the work they are all doing. I reckon orders will probably be starting to flood in as the very nice looking device is shown off. I would say it’s only going to get busier!


RE: The Need For Clear Communications From Purism

I have been happy enough with their communication because I can see progress and I am aware of the difficulty of what they are trying to achieve. I also really want this to succeed! This is a phone that needs to exist. I backed it with the knowledge I might get nothing, which is always a risk with crowd funding, but I was/am confident in Purism to deliver. They are also contributing great things to my favourite OS. :slight_smile:


The lack of perspective and basic critical thinking by some critics here is just astounding to me.

Maybe reviewing some basic facts will help:

  • Librem 5 orders are in the tens of thousands, based on Todd’s recent post (I’ll assume it’s 10,000 to be somewhat conservative).
  • This forum has about 600 active users according to the site stats, which is ~6% of customers if we assume all users are customers, even though we know some aren’t.
  • The very first people in line to get their phones are almost certainly going to be people who work at Purism, the same people who would be absolutely buried in work right now, would not have a lot of free time to post reviews, and may very plausibly feel uncomfortable posting about their phones personally even if there no official rule against it.
  • The next people in line would likely be the most privacy conscious enthusiasts, i.e. probably not the folks who post unboxing and review videos on social media (some probably don’t have social media or Google/YouTube accounts at all).
  • As mentioned numerous times, there are pictures and videos of what appear to be real, functional phones.

Considering all that, what really seems more likely?:
That Purism is shipping phones as promised (tens, perhaps even hundreds), which probably have some significant bugs, which are in the hands of people who are busy trying to use them, living their lives and generally minding their own business rather than posting reviews, and just don’t happen to be part of the ~6% of customers who are also on this forum?

Or that Purism is engaging in some conspiracy to pretend they are producing a functional phone in an extremely short-sighted effort to prevent people from demanding their money back? A conspiracy that anyone with half a brain could predict would backfire quickly and destroy their reputation, possibly leading to the collapse of their entire business?

Some critics have apparently convinced themselves that this is a conspiracy, so evidence to the contrary in the form of pictures, video, and official announcements are being ignored. I would expect that evidence in the form of shipping numbers or other information will be ignored by the same people. I really cannot understand this mindset.

To me, everything that’s been happening seems very plausibly like the legitimate but rocky and difficult launch of a low volume, niche, crowd-funded product. How many Kickstarter projects have significant delays and slow, troublesome launches? A better question might be how many don’t?

Any conspiracy or genuine deception seems very far fetched to me considering all the circumstances.
Purism has an enormous amount to lose by engaging in the level of idiocy that would require, and they really do not seem like idiots to me.


There is also /r/purism which has 3.7k members :wink: Nevertheless there is no guarantee everybody here or everybody there bought a Librem 5 so the numbers aren’t particularly relevant.

Not a single person has alleged the existence of a conspiracy. A conspiracy requires multiple people to coordinate with one another to achieve a desired illicit outcome. We have no idea how the inner operations of the company actually work. We have no idea who even owns shares in the company. Even the ex-employees of Purism don’t seem particularly chatty, much less the current employees. You got to wonder what kind of NDA these people had to sign. Don’t you love all the transparency?

In any event if Purism is on the up and up and the critics like me are wrong, why haven’t they given their Chief Marketing Officer a phone and let him review it on his show? Hell I’m willing to bet he’d overlook any glaring problems and give it a pretty damn positive review. No influencers have the phone. No buyers outside of Purism that we know of have a phone. The only person we definitively know has a phone is the Chairman of the Board. One guy. Tens of thousands of orders.

They claimed for weeks to have an assembly line setup. Yet now the casing of the phone is completely different, right out of the blue. They even gave us pictures of a phone that is clearly not turned on and functioning with this case. My guess? It doesn’t work and they probably only have a few samples of the new case. Welcome to the next delay. But hey there is a new shiny metal case with new shiny metal switches now, so you all should be very happy.

These are bait and switch tactics. It’s a classic approach used to scam marks. Tell them one thing to keep them on the hook and then change it up and throw in just enough “good” news later to gloss over the fact that most of what you said before was complete and utter crap. Rinse and repeat.

Some of you may be wondering why I’m still here as I requested a refund days ago and promised to make myself scarce after I got it. Well that’s still in progress. Confirmed my credit card details earlier today and was told it could take up ten days for the refund to process. I hope it goes quicker than that because I think this situation is about to spiral out of control in the worst sort of way. Once the rush starts, the game is over.

I honestly hope I’m wrong. Maybe I’m just too cynical after years of getting screwed over my faceless amoral corporate entities that use your dependency on them to squeeze you out of your hard earned money while compromising principles you once held dear. I decided a few years back I was done playing that game. For better or worse, that requires me to cut loose of this debacle.


@jaylittle Dude, doesn’t rage quit mean…you quit and go away?
Sorry to be blunt but you did say you canceled and requested a refund in an earlier post so one is left to wonder…


Until the money shows up in my account - there has been no refund. Literally addressed this in my previous post:


O.K. theeeenn. 10-61


… then proceeds to describe what is happening in terms that meet the definition of a conspiracy. :man_shrugging:

Sure, call it a scam instead, doesn’t really change anything. Your fervent, largely baseless distrust and stubbornness are baffling to me regardless.

If spreading fear and anxiety for no good reason is what you feel compelled to do, then I hope whatever drives you to such negativity in your life improves some day.

I’ll wait for my phone that is most likely a real thing I fully expect to receive, and I hope that refund makes you less grumpy.


I wish everybody here spoke the same language. I really do. Here is the definition of conspiracy according to

an evil, unlawful, treacherous, or surreptitious plan formulated in secret by two or more persons; plot

The key here is the “two or more persons” part of it. As I explained previously I have no means of knowing nor theorizing with any degree of accuracy how many people are involved in maintaining and prolonging this alleged charade as we know next to nothing about how Purism actually operates.

Happy now? Oh and transparency FTW!


That looks like actual boxed up phones. That looks like production occurring. Can’t be too much longer …


If you are so desperate to save face that you will pretend you assumed this is all a scam, but simultaneously didn’t dare to assume that more than one person was involved so you could invoke this semantic rebuttal, then I’ll give you that win. You’re right, you didn’t explicitly state more than one person was involved and I unjustly mischaracterized your position (due to my weak grasp of the English language, I guess).

I hope someday your life improves.


@jaylittle i was refunded once by Purism and got my money back but i was more frustrated by undecidedness afterwards because i lost the money that went into currency change with the bank.

since then i’ve promissed to myself that i would hold on no matter what and see it to the end and more …

i really think you ought to reconsider or be a little patient at least untill the end of october.


Something to consider… a possible hint as to what to expect timewise… in the email where Purism asks us to pick which batches we would like to recieve a phone from:

The example they give for how to reply suggests submitting an ask for
1.C 2.D 3.E

They also stated that batch C will have improved power management

I read between the lines and feel it is reasonable to assume that the first 2 batches are more of a Beta test situation (with the first batch ‘Aspen’ distributed essentially internally).

So I am not sweating it. Even if I must buy some duopoly device in the meantime. So what. In the BIG PICTURE…

What is at stake is restoring some Human Rights… I can wait further for a phone that breaks the chains, compared to what is available in the USA as of now.