Trying to see if now is the time

Sometimes I visit my friend with his nonfree TV running. The TV says if I switch cell service providers, I can get free iPhone 15 Pro and free iPad and free Apple watch.

These hardwares are so cheap, they’ll literally give them to you as long as you sign the User Agreement which may, as mentioned by South Park, include a clause that says they will chop you up and stick you in a human experiment. We don’t know for certain though because we haven’t convinced anyone to read their full Apple license agreement. Or at least, I have not.

By contrast, I didn’t have to agree to anything to use my Librem 5 because instead of them buying me, I bought this device from them.

Sent from my Librem 5


Alder Lake? So like Intel 12th generation? If that is struggling with your spreadsheet then, no, I don’t think the Librem 5 will delight you. Having said that, you haven’t told us which specific Alder Lake CPU and there are an awful lot of them and with a wide range of performance.

I’ve tried my Librem 5 with a lapdock (so like an external monitor but better) and performance is quite acceptable. However I haven’t tried LibreOffice as yet and in any case there are spreadsheets and then there are spreadsheets. 100,000 row behemoth with 40,000 cell formulae v. a few thousand rows.

The CPU. (Is that what you meant by the question?)

I don’t think that a custom design would even be needed. The real question would be: Is Qualcomm prepared to open source / release sufficient interface information to meet the required standard of privacy and security?

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I have four batteries for my Librem 5 and multiple battery chargers that operate without the Librem 5. I almost always have my Librem 5 on and available with charge, day and night, and almost never connect it to a charging cable other than for the “fast charge,” which is to say I plug in to charger, rip out the battery while the device is on, and insert an 80-100% charged battery, then unplug from power. Process takes a few seconds and puts me to full power, without restarting or losing my running programs or apps.

This capability, for all I can tell, makes a mockery of Apple and Android batteries and puts them to shame. It’s on a different planet. I just replace the battery with a full one; I don’t even wait.

But really, it sounds like you have spent a lot of time with the social medium. Is “hype” the deciding factor for whether you use a device? Frankly, I would rather to make my own choices if possible.

This almost sounds to me as though you have spent so long being manipulated by your technology, and treating manipulation as a normal way to communicate, that you are now hoping to manipulate Purism into attending to your specific software needs so that your Librem 5 has the specific apps or programs you want. I am only a user; I do not speak for Purism. My opinions are my own.

But I think that your hope to manipulate them into servicing you will probably never succeed. Instead, they are a hardware company that will continue to sell hardware, and if you have a specific hardware problem you can contact Purism support and they are usually happy to assist.

The barrier to me daily driving Librem 5 wasn’t the Librem 5. I didn’t really have the sense that Purism was the problem. The problem was that around the same time my phone arrived, my work contacted me and said “HURR DUR NEW UPDATE ALL EMPLOYEES NEED ANDROID OR IOS APP IN ORDER TO WORK” and tried to force me out of using my new $2000 phone (I got a Liberty Phone for the enhanced RAM at the time).

I don’t think anyone I work with had hostile intentions in that regard. But society as a whole pushes them that way. Some percentage of the social conglomerate of people and technology is already AI. It might be fair to say it is conscious or in the process of becoming conscious. So, if/when you try to break free, probably at that same time this conscious entity is going to fight back. It’s going to jab that sticker up in your gut and whisper in its subconscious language of suggestions, “Hey, sucker, how much are you willing to really give up to be free?”

And as you accurately pointed out, most people will probably respond to that kind of torture by rejoining the conventional way of technology.

The human puts the plastic square in its pocket all day.
The human keeps the plastic square always on.
The human charges the plastic square each night.
The human agrees to the use of the Location Services to keep a record of the location of the human at all times.

These are your orders. You can choose to follow them, or not. You sound like someone who will follow them.

But I have a request for you, actually. And I hope you can remember my request and keep it in your heart: I will never try to force you to use a Librem 5, but please never try to force me to use the kind of phone you have. In this way, please do unto others as you would have others do unto you. It’s a simple golden rule, but if you ever have the chance, please apply it with regards to how you treat someone like me.

I want to be a Librem 5 user. You can tell me it’s bad. You can tell me it doesn’t work. You can tell me I’m a Purism fanboy shill wasting money. By your definitions I probably wouldn’t win those arguments. But please don’t tell me how to live my life, or that I should have to use the same device you use, because surely you can see how upset you would be if I did the same to you – given that you “don’t want to get wet.”

Sent from my Librem 5 [while it wasn’t plugged into a wall]


In my opinion:

For someone on the Android/iPhone-MORE!-MORE!-MORE!-Bigger!-Better!-Faster!-Thinner!-apps!-apps!-apps!-NOW! upgrade train, the Librem 5 is bound to disappoint at the moment.

For someone who realizes the Librem 5 is a privacy-protecting GNU/Linux computer with adequate RAM for running Linux, (with similar battery life to some laptops, by the way), that can already take advantage of much of the pre-existing Linux software in the Debian world, which also includes telephone functionality that is still a work in progress but mostly functions well and is constantly improving, and for someone who can adapt their usage to its features and/or limitations, the Librem 5 will not disappoint.

That said, I’m not using my Librem 5 as my main phone yet, but I hope to switch over from degoogled Android eventually, when a few more improvements have been implemented. :slight_smile:


I’m not sure this is a reliable way to get their attention in the community forums. They’re mostly busy elsewhere. You might want to email them instead, or ping one of their reps directly from here.


By the way, T-mobile USA and T-mobile-based MVNOs are essentially the only option for the North American variant of the L5 modem, if that’s relevant to you. [EDIT: For US users, I mean.]

Or a data-only SIM combined with SIP calling or XMPP.


AT&T ( and MVNO’s) works but you have to register on a ‘compliant device’.


Have a look at this detailed review: part 1, part 2.


Hopefully AT&T won’t notice, and then disable functionality. :wink:


A lot has been said,
i have seen the written review. Yes.
My alder lake is n100 running mint.
If the cpu limits the ram, that definitely explains the limitations.
I live in canada so rogers is my go to for isp.
As for the hype, im saying it to promote the device so others consider it too… if the company profits, the device gets better.
Battery replacement means shutting device off. In what world its acceptable?
My phone is literally my life. Its how i make money. If im driving and phone died and i now have to pull over to replace it. Then the whole idea is irrelevant.
I of course understand we all have different demands…
Im just trying to see where it stands. How long until battery drains?
My garbabge os samsung fold lasts a day with ease…

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Or plug it in and replace battery while it’s still on and connected.

Most phones don’t even have a removable battery, though.


Trust me you are paying for the device one way or another. The carriers basically absorbed the cost of the handsets, but they are getting their money back through your contract. If you break the contract you’ll be paying the balance owed on that handset.

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Fwiw, I have a higher-power-than-typical usb charger that I can plug into my car, and I’ve switched batteries while driving and without shutting the phone off. Obviously not recommending anyone else do this, just wanted to offer a real life example of what is possible.


If I understood you correctly, L5 is not ready for your needs. Purism tries to make open sorce powered device as much as possible for free decentralized services, but it is a long and uncertain journey. So demanding and impatience makes no sense. Of course, your or my business needs don’t work that way. We often have to use non-free service,applications and hardware that we use. We must support project like L5 because they give us the possibility of decentralization and more. 3 or 30GB is less important in this case.
Personally L5 use private xmpp, calls …etc and for biz G OS .

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I use the L5 as a daily, you have been linked to my posts about my experience with the device. Ask and l will try to answer.

As for your demand about battery replacement, this is a ludicrous comment. I know some very well connected people that make their living off of their phones and all of them could put the phone down for 2 minutes to change the battery. As someone posted, there aren’t even any phones on the market in the category you are comparing to that let you replace batteries. We don’t have one of these available yet, however, something like this would help: Battery Charger Cases: Electronics

Anyway, I did some testing. I can get 17h of battery life out of an L5 as you can see in a thread here: I am getting 17h of battery time on my Librem5. Are you?

HEAVY HEAVY daily usage on the L5 gets me 8h of battery life (no watching of videos, just calls and a bit of web browsing, network access, network troubleshooting, etc.): Librem 5 - Daily driven in professional use - SUCCESS

I guess you read some of the above, for me, it is my daily and I make money off of my phone. Here is my take on the battery issue:

  1. Realistically, my androids are not all that spectacular with respect to battery life. They only SEEM that way for two reasons:

a) Native drivers for everything and all apps are driver aware making it unlikely someone would publish an app that burns through battery life.

b) Andorid environments tend to be EXTREMELY aggressive with power saving modes, especially the screen. Maybe you can change those to your liking on your android but on my device I cannot do much.

My android is so aggressive about power saving that it makes it borderline useless.

  1. My L5 is a linux environment and it isn’t nearly as aggressive about power savings and I can keep the screen on for as long as I need to. That doesn’t seem like much but the display is what chews through the battery the most and that is what will be the main cause of battery drain. The other cause of battery drain is the lack of aggressive power savings which I don’t want because I actually use my L5 the way I use my laptop and apps not being aware of hardware acceleration and some of them forcing the rendering of their ui to software rendering via the cpu.

If you read between the lines, since we already get 17h of battery life on the L5, it means we have to tweak all of the other variables to get something approaching your Samsung experience. Unfortunately, that will mean that we have to get hyper aggressive about power savings and your user experience will end up like your user experience on the Samsung.

For me, the practical solution is to just figure out how to get multiple batteries arranged into a battery pack and built into a phone case simply because I DO NOT want to use the phone as a phone, I want to use it’s full power and that means I want to burn through battery power. If the case had removable battery compartments, that would actually be a new level of amazing. Looking into it.

That is my take some of your points.


You know, I am actually just going to buy a bunch of batteries now and that charger you linked to in the other thread and just do this. It just makes sense.


I have a car charger that works fine with the Librem 5 i.e. cigarette lighter to USB-C power delivery. So if you are literally in your car then just keep the phone on charge and the battery will never die.

As @amarok points out, providing that the phone is on charge, you can swap batteries without shutting down. So even if “on the road” and not keeping the phone on charge all the time while in the car, you could use the car charger to swap batteries when needed.

If you are a road warrior then a worse (current) limitation for you may be that the Librem 5 may not yet support the HeadSet Profile (HSP) for Bluetooth. So you can’t pair the phone with the car and thereby make and receive calls using the car (which in some countries could make actual use of the phone in a car that is not parked unlawful, and attract a fine and demerit points).

Then you would want to have two phones regardless of what make and model.


Same for me. However, the Librem 5 still slowly discharges when connected to it when the screen is on and I’m for example browsing. Probably the charger is just not delivering enough power in my case. I did not yet try getting another charger.

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I have one new vehicle with built-in power delivery and two old ones with cigarette lighter chargers. All three charge my L5, even while playing local media, streaming or heavy web browsing – even when navigating.

Is this not the usual user experience?

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No, I trickle-charge my Librem 5 USA turned off using my Librem 14 because the original power adapter does not work. I also do not have a car.

I remember a discussion about “privacy-respecting cars” a while back in the Purism community forums.

I can watch youtube videos and charge the L5 as a comparison point. It gets really hot though when I do.