Uh oh. doubt is here :(

I’ve seen quite a few articles and watched various videos and all I have seen is general doubt in the purism company from terminating workers who have shown doubt in the success on the librem 5 to people constantly complaining about the CEO and his poor decisions. The company says their funding isn’t coming from pre-orders to pay for expenses of orders of the first backers and say that the company is financially stable from selling their laptops though I recieved an email from purism on the take down of one of my threads where they considered what I said as trolling which I consider would be fair becuase I was shi**ing all over the company and they had said in the email they were financially stable. Like everyone, we want the company to succeed so we can get a good product and becuase the company shows themselves to be FSF compliant for an OS on a phone ehich is pretty crazy. I used to believe in this company when I first heard about their librem 5 but the phone is barely able to do any normal functions of a phone (from what I’ve heard) from it not even being able to do the number one principle of a phone of making a phone call. Until I see some hard evidence about not the company going to make it and succeed but until they literally have, I cannot trust the company. Yes I know those who have full trust in the company are going to sh*t all over me but I don’t really care. I don’t want this company to crash and burn as not because I support their product (or their pricing for that matter) but that I support what the product stands for: a big middle finger against non open source software and government spying. When I see a working phone and a phone that will keep working, I’m not sending them 750USD before tax for a phone. Furthermore, their laptops (in my opinion) aren’t bad but are just about ok though I like the thought of kill switches and the whole USB key thing to see if anybody has modified your computer with installation of a rootkit or something else but I think I would rather keep my eyes on system 76 if I stop being broke one day. I don’t want someone to just attack me or say that I am linux dumb or just plain stupid but to critique every part of what I am saying in a nornal manner and to prove my doubt, and so many others I see on the internet, that this product will make it and will be worth the price.
edit: yes I do know phone calling works now but after how much work? Just got the first function of a phone down after so much work while there is still so much work to do. Yes I know it’s hard to build a phone but that doesn’t fully excuse the device of not functioning well.

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“…but that doesn’t fully excuse the device of (sic) not functioning well.”

Yes it does.


a mouse is climbing a branch in the forest.
A lizard passes and asks the mouse what it does and the mouse answers: as soon as the lion passes I kill it.
A deer passes and asks the mouse what it does and the mouse replies:
as soon as the lion passes I kill him.
Upon hearing this, the lion passes under the branch and asks the mouse what it does climbing the branch and the mouse replies:
I rub my nails, scratch my nose and I say what I don’t know.


ok then … do you know how much money went into the Big Tech industry until this point so that “it-just-works” ?

how about the other Government/Military projects that we have no idea about ?

not too long ago @amosbatto quoted a 1.2 trillion dollar figure for the M$ ecosystem ALONE … and a few days ago i quoted a 30+ billion IOT devices prognosis for 2020 so what do you know exactly ?


Haha. I’m the dumb one as always. I get it. I guess we will see at evergreen if it’s remotely ready and if it’s even coming in Q2.

Alright thanks. Great analogy to simply say I’m stupid.

To me, your post can be summed up as follows:

I’ve read a bunch of articles, seen videos, all of which come to a conclusion that have zero proof behind it. Yet, I’ve reached the same conclusions, and want others on this forum to validate my assumptions.

Anyone pointing out the obvious fallacy to my assumptions are simply picking on me, instead of pointing out the obvious.

That all aside, what do you really expect those of us on this forum to say? Do we worry about similar things? Do we consider it a possibility? Are we willfully blind to a company possessing the ability to have problems? Of course we aren’t, and of course we can consider those possibilities. However, we also WANT Purism to succeed!

Going onto their own forum to talk about there eventual downfall is just bad form no matter how you try to bundle it up. So don’t act surprised when you get some backlash from it.


Not suprised I got backlash. Maybe I’m sick and I enjoy it. I understand your viewpoint. Guess I’ll sh** talk on some IRC or not evil chat group. I’m arrogant, annoyed and always sceptical. Practically a part of who I am when I watch everything else fail and watch one finally start to stumble to their feet on the war field. I would like to know further how what I say is an obvious fallacy if you don’t mind. To clarify, I do think what others are saying is kind of picking on me from everyone except @Gavaudan but I’m used to it from school and generally just life and if it means someone like you can break my doubt to think that this won’t be another fail like mozilla phone, I think it is always worth it. Sorry if I sounded pretentious or stepped on your nerves or something.


How about instead of intentionally crap talking, just don’t. How does that benefit anybody at all?

Or… just don’t? Save yourself and others some drama.

I’m not telling you not to be skeptical or wary or anything. But spreading negativity just doesn’t benefit anyone.


I wouldn’t dare say you’re stupid. But try to think if the famous message from Linus Torvalds in 1991 had been answered … but it still doesn’t make everything work.
Dream boy dream


Alright. I’ll just internalize my scepticism of the project so people’s feelings dont get hurt. Guess that’s the best option.

on the other hand do NOT internalize …WE’re to blame for not seeing that we’re dealing with a PERSON who’s - probably - much younger than we are !!!

shame on US … i apologize - don’t take it personally … us grown ups should be MUCH more understanding/patient

first and foremost the purism forums SHOULD be a place of TEACHING besides the occasional trolling … don’t take it to heart kid …


I am pretty confident that all these issues will be fixed eventually, as these are things that can be changed from software, and they are doing lots of improvements on the software. Even if Purism goes under, the phone is open enough that as long as we are determined, we can fix it ourselves, as a community.

My biggest concern is actually the possible strain on such a small company if the COVID-19 virus eventually causes more problems in China and the world economy as a whole. This could affect everything as it continues, with the Librem 5 being one of many possible casualties, and one of the only ones people can’t practically stockpile beforehand. There is a supposedly 70% chance of a recession in the next 6 months (but such bearish predictions have been being made for a while, so we could also have a few more years), and with COVID-19 being called a black swan, also in this other article I have not finished reading yet, if the world economy is seriously disrupted, the Librem 5 could, of course, also be disrupted. I really hope that the world economy stays intact enough for the Librem 5 Fir to be made. The news I read tends to be very bearish, after all, so maybe things will not get as bad as they predict possible.

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we’ve been kind of naughty so far … so this stalemate COULD teach us an important lesson … maybe learn to appreciate free-software more ?

Ah this is so fun. I guess I’m still somewhat young but I think you see me as a 12 year old. Always thought others saw me older than I am so this is a huge win.

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What do you so specifically despise about me so much? I want to know. I’ve been trying to improve my character :grinning:

I thought the virus wouldn’t have created too much of an issue though. There should be a vacine in what 3 months were the predictions? Only effects the most young and the elderly. But maybe it will have a significant impact like you say.
I thought they would be able to fix issues in software but I’m concerned over the hardware’s capabilities. I don’t really play mobile video games with the most intensive that I play probably being mindustry but I’m not sure of multi tasking would be amazing on the phone with 3GB of RAM which is still a lot for a phone but I was hoping for at least 4GB but that’s not too concerning I guess. The community fixing if the company goes under seems good but the community isn’t exactly large but I guess it will still work. The heating issues will probably be fixed through software but I have (I know I have a lot of this) doubt about there being something fundamentally wrong with the phone’s heat disapation which couldn’t be fixed through software. I guess we’ll see a few months into launch. Thanks for giving me criticism.

Now that you mention it, RAM is something that I am pretty concerned about too, that I hope can be fixed in Fir for longevity purposes. My current phone, a OnePlus One, has almost the exact same specs, and RAM has certainly caused me trouble with web browsing in the past. Testing the phone in a VM, I also couldn’t compile alacritty without incressing the RAM to 4GB, but to be fair I hear that ARM compilation might take less RAM than x86_64. RAM is especially concerning to me, as I plan to use this phone as a substitute for a laptop, since no laptops I know of have the UNIX keyboard layout I like, and my external keyboard is super high-end and expensive so I want to use it; and RAM always seems to be my limitation there too.

I wouldn’t call this criticism so much as feedback, by the way, as I only slightly disagree with the subject of the skepticism, rather than disagreeing with skepticism itself.

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I strongly doubt this phone will be powerful enough to be a sub for a laptop. For what I expect from a laptop, mine barely does the job at the moment and a phone with somehow less ram and other specs like graphical performance not being so great makes that an impossible option for me but use case could be different for you so maybe it will be fine for you.

You seem to expect a lot from a lot of things. Don’t take this the wrong way, but perhaps that is the root of all your issues.

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