Keep an eye on pine64, purism isn’t the only game in town. Pine is currently developing their watch as part of their ecosystem.
pay with apple pay
That’s an interesting one. Does Apple lock all non-Apple devices out of that?
This is simply an omission in my editing. I originally made the list from the context of how I use my iPhone and edited it to generically be what I expect to be able to do with a phone. So I should have changed this to something like “pay with the phone”. I know there are other ways to pay with non Apple phones, so I’d like to know if there’s a way you could be able to pay with the Librem 5.
exec custom code
To me that is a no-brainer. It is mainstream Linux. I should be able to run my own programs, presumably even today.I think python may be the best fit for you.
I think there’s a misunderstanding here. This is a sub-item of “digital assistant”. Perhaps the indenting didn’t come through due to the browser rendering. I know that executing custom code on a Linux device is a no-brainer. I’m a programmer after all and I work in a Linux environment. But as you already pointed out, doing that via a digital assistant, I.e. spoken command, is not a no-brainer. I do this with my iPhone via Siri Shortcuts. I code a shortcut and associate it with a spoken command. The one I use the most is a shortcut I wrote to parse the NJ Transit website. I associated it with the spoken command “When is the next bus to work?”
I’m glad to hear 1Password can work on Linux. I haven’t used it before, but I did look into it once. Does it just do passwords, or can it do secure notes? And can it do attachments? Apple getting rid of keychain sync with mobile me was one of the first times they truly pissed me off.
I’m aware that the list is premature. I just don’t want to assume that it can’t do any of this stuff out of the box or that there aren’t 3rd party repos that can do these things on Linux. With Apple, I rarely if ever, need to install 3rd party stuff, aside from those apps I listed. I was glad they handled all that because I didn’t want to be bothered. I just wanted it all to work. The problem though is that I painfully notice it when they drop features and kill my battery with updates and planned obsolescence.
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Even so, I think this is likely to be a difficult area for Linux. Behemoth companies like Apple and Google will get market share within merchants, and merchants won’t be very interested in supporting niche alternative payment platforms. It could come down to the attitude of the authorities in a given country - whether they allow that or whether they insist on an open payment platform.
The best option may be “pay with cryptocurrency”.
My bad. Yes, a misunderstanding. Your formatting was accurately rendered.
Honestly I would not be too optimistic about voice control. However everything that a person would like to do via voice control, presumably they still want to be able to do that some other way if there is no voice control.
I have not seen any particular statement from Purism regarding voice control.
Sorry, I don’t use it. Perhaps best to follow the link to the other topic, which is specifically about password stores, and ask there. However that topic suggests “Password Safe”.
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I think your list is a good idea, premature or no. These questions will come up eventually, particularly when/if the librem 5 takes off, and it’s not a bad idea to get something started towards answering them. Unfortunately I don’t have any of those answers for you (I’ve forgone pretty much all of your entire list at one point or another), but it makes me happy that here, or somewhere, the questions will have some sort of coherent form such that they can be answered.
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The Librem 5 already has GNOME Clock, so it has a working alarm clock, stop watch and timer.
It has a Gedit, so you can make lists, but maybe you are thinking about a specific list app.
It has the GNOME Calculator, so you can do math.
Yes, you can “add web stuff to home screen”. You can take any web page and add it as an app to your desktop, so you can go to a web site that reports the weather and add it as a weather app to your desktop.
Yes, GNOME Web (epiphany) can run JavaScript.
Bluetooth is now working.
You can use GNOME Sound Recorder to record voice.
The cameras aren’t working right now, but it is planned to use Cheese for video recording.
Lollypop is working in the Librem 5 for playing music. I have no idea if it can be played in the background right now.
You can install Slack in Linux, but it probably isn’t designed to handle small screens and I have no idea if an ARM port is available, but I doubt it.
Dropbox works in web browser, so you can use it that way.
I have no idea what most of your specific apps are, since I only use apps found in F-Droid on my phone. If it runs in a web browser, then it will work in the Librem 5, but you might have to change certain security settings in the web browser to get it to work as you want. For example, you need to allow the web browser to allow sharing of the geolocation, and I’m not sure if the Librem 5 will allow GNOME Web to access the GNSS, so you might not get precise location.
I recommend that you install Qemu and download the latest image of the Librem 5 and run it on your PC to see what apps are available, and then try installing the other apps that you want using the apt install command. See: https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Development_Environment/Boards/qemu.html
There are a lot of things available in GTK + GNOME, but they aren’t using the libhandy classes and they haven’t adapted the dialog boxes, so they won’t work well on a small screen. For example, you can install Gimp to edit photos, but it will be a very painful process without a mouse and the interface is designed for a large screen.
I expect that a lot more GTK apps will be adapted for the Librem 5 within six months or a year after release, but don’t expect a lot of GTK software to work well in Q2 of 2020 when the Evergreen batch starts shipping.
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For a digital assistant, see this discussion about MyCroft:
“Words with friends” is basically online Scrabble.
“Shazam” is an online app which listens to music and tells you the artist and title. (It’s actually pretty good.)
As with all online services, getting a vendor interested in supporting Linux will be a struggle. So it may depend on having a container for Android apps.
For “Words with friends” it wouldn’t be too hard to implement it oneself. (Adding: Not volunteering to do anything other than English though. 
)
Tunity - scans a tv with the camera to determine the channel and provides the synchronized audio through your phone for that channel. I use it at the gym to watch tv while I ride the stationary bike. Good for public muted TVs.
Wyze cam - security camera app for Wyze brand cameras. These cams will notify you through the app if they hear an alarm, like a smoke alarm.
Google voice - allows you to make phone calls using your google voice phone number (a free VOIP service). Definitely not conforming to the Librem 5 ideals though. I use my GV number with businesses to prevent spam calls because it’s easy to block callers, especially those without caller ID, and has call screening.
Duo mobile - 2 factor authentication app that my work uses.
Automatic - app for a car computer port dongle that allows you to diagnose and dismiss check engine light problems.
BTW, I think I should probably specify that “supported” means designed for a mobile device and touch interface. So I’m not sure if my latest updates to the table are accurate or not. Does gnome support a touch interface and a small screen? I haven’t used it in awhile, but I suspect it doesn’t. If there’s a mouse/cursor involved, I don’t think it should be marked as supported.
Regarding the comment on (shared) lists… I was slow to adopt the usage of Apple’s Reminders app as a place to maintain stuff like to-do lists. I was using the notes app and its checkbox feature for the longest time. I still use it for my extended to-do list, but after I realized these 3 things, I started using reminders for to-do items:
- You can paste an entire list and each line becomes a separate item with a checkbox
- Using the recurring reminder feature for recurring to-do items means less work to sit down and review what needs to be done
- I can maintain multiple categorical lists and the undone items all get grouped in a “Today” view - which makes it much easier to see all the to-do items yet keep everything categorized
So I don’t think a text editing tool is a sufficient stand-in for a list app, especially since I presume you cannot mutually edit it with another person (e.g. either one of us can go to the grocery store and we instantly know what’s been bought and what hasn’t).
I use Standard Notes for creating todo lists and taking notes. It works very well on PureOS and iOS.
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Wow, that’s nice. I may have to start using that for my secure notes on iOS, though I see there’s no mobile Linux version, but perhaps the web version will be mobile friendly?
Oh gee. No, the web version is not mobile friendly, at least not in iOS.
I can’t afford Google’s “free” VOIP service. 
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Purism is creating Phosh to use instead of GNOME Shell, and Phosh does support touch interfaces and a small screen. However, Purism is taking GNOME applications and adapting them to use the libhandy classes and changing the interfaces to work in a phone.
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I like this feature mapping table - eventually it will show if there are any needs that need to be addressed (by whom ever).
But, looking at this in mind that the table (and tracking how the features in it get covered) could be developed further, I think the columns could be reconsidered. As the program ecosystem is a bit different on this side (from IOS and Andro), I find it a bit problematic (something that was already implied by others) to label Purism (“supported/3rd party”) to be responsible for most of the things on the list. Some come via GNOME and almost all come from community. Also, the list does not present how well something is supported. There is also the point (made previously as well), that some of these are not features that are desirable to many - they even might go against the idea of L5 [remembering of course that everyone has their own idea and way of use].
What if the columns would contain info on “implemented/supported via….” [possible Linux program name (+link)] and “level of usability” [“perfectly on L5 screen and usable controls” / “mostly usable/viewable” / “partly usable” / “planned or worse”]? Then this list could be used to track better how mature the “ecosystem of features” is.
Or does this make any sense? Further development of classifications or just discarding the idea are also valid options…
Other, separate TL thoughts that are only weakly connected to topic:
(click to see ramblings)
Going to the territory of “what is the essence/core phone (these days)”. We have had threads about what features and apps are wanted but I can’t remember a discussion of the bare minimum (which I consider different from the “minimum features” L5 was promised to have) that is acceptable as a platform (a phone - or rather a hand held computer, something different from “smart” phones). And as this could go to very atomic/code/blob level fast, I’ll add that the intended level of discussion here is “install packets/apps via GUI”.
On the other hand, feature list makes sense (to me) only if there is some limit to them. With “smart” phones there is - if nothing else, they are controlled by their ecosystem overlords. L5 is - kinda, somewhat - limitless in comparison. Although, at the moment, it is limited by resources (including know-how) to have “everything” right now. Those in need or want are limited by those few who might know how to make (who may have other things to do). But over time this should rectify itself.
And about some of the unwanted features and apps: some of them are - simplified - about “not knowing for sure” and “not being in control” and this obstacle could be circumvented by being able to have services/apps “in phone” or “in own server”, instead of in the cloud and in in the dark. Even a closed code app could be managed reasonably (info stays contained) in comparison. Challenge is, of course, that L5 (or any other user device) might not have the computing power and memory to run some of these (at least at expected speeds). I say, this is mostly just how systems are designed and they could be done differently as well. Also, most exotic features are used so seldom and impact our life so little, that they could be dropped - if Shazam [just a quick example] is like oxygen to you, I’d like to hear how you got that way. So… some of these - I hate to use “smart” in this context but what ever - features could meybe be had safely but require major re-thinking, going back to old ways of software.
Lastly, a “smart phone” seems almost silly. L5 is a handheld mini computer. Smart phones broadly speaking are too, but they have the previously mentioned limits. A genuine computer, as I see it, is digital device that can be and do anything it is programmed to do (it can change freely) - as opposed to analog, that can only be what it was made to be. The “smart” phones of today seem to be going back to analog direction in that sense, because commercially it makes sense to lock people in to ecosystems. And “smart” was meant to imply, that a device could do things more than what was directly commanded from it. So, since these could not be done in the phone, “smart” then became to mean that these services were implemented at server farms. And isn’t that where users lost safety, control, of devices. In this context, “smart” is almost synonym to limited. And such devices more often upload data uncontrollably. Which all has been a long winded way to get to something else: L5 is a “safe” phone and computer. Not just a phone or a computer. And not “smart” as it is now defined. The term “secure” (phone) in this context is something different: it’s a process and needs user to keep the phone secure and use it in a secure manner.
These thoughts almost manage to point - regarding thread topic - out that defining a set feature requirements list that all might agree on, or one that might fit L5, might be a bit much. But an updated list that just has different popular features tracked might have longevity and be useful. Some features may take a long time but they are not absolutely impossible to have, even safely.
And (one more thing), wouldn’t it be nice, if this list could be linked to the apps in development list (in wiki) somehow…?
Sorry about the long post.
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Absolutely. I did realize that it was qualitatively deficient for individual items, but being completely out of the loop, I was coming from it from a standpoint of: as a user/consumer, can it be done, period, at any level of feature support? From a development standpoint, I would definitely granularize each item.
As far as I’m concerned, I feel like I have enough information for my purposes, i.e. at this point, I’m not prepared to dive into a pure Linux phone and I’m beginning to wonder about how I would do these things in Android, and whether I would have the same overall issues with Android that I do with Apple, I.e. dropping features, planned obsolescence, and battery killing updates?
Switching to Android will benefit you none if you’re trying to get away from planned obsolescence
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One thing that you can do is buy an Android phone and install LineageOS and the F-Droid repo. Then, only install the programs that you really need from the Google Play Store. I have been doing that since 2015, and I’m fairly happy, but you need to read the comments on the XDA-Developers forum about the LineageOS port for the particular model of phone that you buy to make sure that it is fully compatible with LineageOS. For example, I had a Moto Pure Edition that never worked well, because the LineageOS port for that model didn’t support the second microphone for background noise cancelation. From that experience, I learned to read the comments on the forum before buying a phone.
There is no guarantee that the community will keep creating ports for your model of phone with each new version of LineageOS. In my experience, someone will always try to create a port for the latest version of LineageOS, but it might have bugs. The ports seem to always be good with Nexus, Pixel and OnePlus, but you need to investigate the particular model if buying any other brand. A number of Xiaomi models have good LineageOS ports, but Xiaomi has a very annoying policy for unlocking the bootloader.
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I think what you’re asking is what can be made/ported to a flatpak and effectively work with the librem 5s hardware? That question has yet to be answered because there is not yet a robust community of people making/porting what they want yet. The list is incredibly helpful because it tells what one person, and likely more people, want
I don’t believe many of the Librem 5s proggys are going to come from purism. It’s not like a regular phone where you get what you get until the next update/model, rather any user can make/port whatever they want and distribute the flatpak. Party like it’s 1999 
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