Librem 5 Fir Batch

Hi all,

I know this topic was bought up last year, but has there been any news, discussion or info on the Librem 5 Fir batch?

Will it be released this year?

Or is this something for way in the future?

Is everyone waiting for the Evergreen in August?

Or are we willing to sweat it out for Fir? :grin::grin:

Thanks in advance

LinuxNew

PS Who would like a Librem desktop or Librem 15 version 5 for Christmas 2020 maybe??

Come on its possible?

:grin::grin::+1:

Considering that Dogwood won’t come until early July, I assume that Evergreen will come in October or November.

Based on that, I predict that Fir will come in Q4 2021. The i.MX 8M Plus should have 20% better CPU performance and is more energy efficient, but it has a worse GPU. Maybe we will get more RAM and more Flash memory with Fir, but I don’t think that Fir is worth the wait.

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q4 2021 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZoJ2Pt27BY

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I am.

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and I (20 characters)

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and I. Looking forward. Even, in worst case, not delivered at all, I’m glad to have added some resources to bring a Linux phone closer to realization … The road to it is more exciting than the final product.

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I’m waiting for my Evergreen.

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That is how I see it as well. If I can help finance the creation of mobile Linux as a viable alternative to the Android and iOS duopoly, then I will have done some good in the world. If we can help create a market for Linux phones that aren’t based on planned obsolescence and surveillance Capitalism, then the world will definitely be a better place.

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Me, too… but my old Galaxy S III is finally dying. I even dropped it for the millionth time, but this time the screen shattered. Not sure it will last until Evergreen (wherever I happen to be in that queue). I’m flirting with the idea of buying a Pinephone PostMarketOS CE, on sale in a couple of weeks. PostMarket uses PHOSH, so it will give me a first look on actual hardware. If I like it, I’ll keep it around as a backup to the Librem 5.

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Been trying to hold on with my DTEK60. 4 years old(?), cracked front and back, camera glass destroyed, battery life ranging from 30m to 3hr(not even heavy usage). I basically have to leave it plugged in. It hurts. :[

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this is June 23rd :sweat_smile:

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As someone who’s waiting for Fir, the main reason I do so is because I’m hoping for a more “mature” product, as opposed to wanting the latest hardware.

I don’t have programming experience so I want a linux privacy-respecting phone to use as a daily driver, as opposed to a gadget I can “tinker” with.

Regarding timelines, considering how Purism has vastly underestimated the complexity of the task of developing a new phone architecture from scratch (I supported the project during the crowdfunding campaign in 2017 and back then, the promise was for delivery within a year), I don’t expect Fir to come out before mid-2022.

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Considering that the original timeline was for Fir to ship 6 months after Evergreen, I’m predicting that it will be 12 months.

If it were just an issue of producing a new PCB for the i.MX 8M Plus, then 6 months is probably doable. The big question for me is whether Fir requires any special mainline Linux kernel work. The i.MX 8M Plus has added a bunch of new components (digital signal processor, neural processor & hardware video encoder) and changed the secondary core from Cortex-M4F to Cortex-M7, so I bet that it will require some kernel work, and NXP has been lackluster in getting its i.MX 8 chips supported in mainline Linux.

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Ya know I was wondering if I’m the only one in the fir batch on here. It’s quite aways off but Once I get my L5 it will be my daily driver . Which is why I didnt go for evergreen . It seems the overheating issues and battery usage are just coming up a bit under daily driver status …

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Without wishing to argue with someone who clearly knows much more about the topic than me, I’ll just point out my reasoning. The shipping announcement was ~10 months ago and in the communications I’ve had with Purism where I requested to be allocated to Fir, it was pointed out that Fir is a future product. Indeed we’ve seen no commitments or even official comments on the hardware and even the CPU hasn’t been officially confirmed afaik.

I’m sure development of the Librem 5 has been financially draining for Purism and I suspect orders during the last quarter (if not more) have been low. That’s why Purism has continued to launch new products (Librem One, Librem mini) as it tries to keep the cash flow going. If I were in their shoes, I’d wait to see the reception Evergreen has before committing resources to develop V2.

Interestingly enough, in the August 2019 CCC Nicole mentioned that their choice of CPU was largely dictated by the fact that at the time (2017) the i.MX SoC was the only one supporting free GPU drivers but in the meantime others had become available (https://media.ccc.de/v/Camp2019-10238-a_mobile_phone_that_respects_your_freedom#t=1013 slide 22). I wonder whether this means that other SoCs could now be viable options.

@Some_dude36, indeed, battery use, reception quality and app ecosystem are my main concerns too, that’s why I opted to wait as long as it takes.

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The Lima driver for Mali GPUs from Arm Holdings was added to Mesa in May 2019. Mali is used by HiSilicon Kirin, Samsung Exynos, MediaTek Helios, Rockchip, Amlogic and Allwinner, but Rockchip is probably the only one of those companies that Purism wants to work with, since Kirin, Exynos and Helios all integrate a WiFi, Bluetooth, cellular modem and GNSS. Amlogic and Allwinner produce chips for tablets, but they don’t have a good relationship with the community, whereas Rockchip does. However, the RK3399 probably sucks too much power, but the future RK3588 would make a good SoC for a phone, but we don’t know if it can run on all free software at this point.

Really the only viable options for Purism in Aug. 2017 were NXP i.MX 6, i.MX 8M or Broadcom BCM2837, and there are still issues with the BCM2837 terms of 100% free software.

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I think Fir would be a lot of work. When they release a schedule for it’s release and if it’s too far away for you, I’m sure (hope) you can jump to the Evergreen and get it shipped ASAP.

@arisdorf I don’t think Purism releasing other products indicates they have cash problems. Having a company put all of it’s eggs in one basket is a bad business decision. They cannot delay all their other plans just because one product was delayed and delayed.

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The good news is that when the masses (myself included) get their Evergreen phones you will know how well it matches up to daily driver status and you might in principle decide to change to Evergreen or it might confirm your choice to opt for Fir.

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I hope for Evergreen soon. After receiving my long awaited Linux phone, I most probably (and when an offer is available) will also go for the Fir. Anyway I’m still using my old and trusted Ubuntu BQ phone for 5 years now, where the average user buys a new one every 2 years :wink:

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I’ll take a L15 please! Thanks :grin:

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