Louis Rossmann's opinion on Librem 5

The widely known technician on Youtube space voiced distrust and concern about Librem 5 https://youtu.be/nKzu6-92SV8?t=2079 phone.

Crazy idea what if Purism sends him one ? :slight_smile: maybe to prove him wrong?

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He said he is not convinced Purism isn’t just riding the wave of privacy awareness to make money.

I think given the amount of money they make and the amount of software (IE: real tangible things) they have released and upstreamed this is an unfounded belief.

I think if Mr. Rossman knew about these things he would not feel the way he does. Rossman is great, but man does he like to talk. Purism, is basically the very thing he himself has advocated for in many of his long rants on planned obsolescence, etc. Like me, what Purism is trying to do on the hardware side resonates with many people way before the FOSS side of the house even matters.

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I feel the same :slight_smile:

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A trouble with old age is the “widely known” moniker. I keep seeing in the news headlines about famous-person (a) did (b). And I ask myself who the hell was that? Especially if (b) meant “died”.

Then again for watching “technicans” on youtube, I’m the kind of guy that watches “curiousmarc”.

Here is the comment that I posted to Rossmann’s video (which nobody reads because YouTube has a poorly designed comment system if you want intelligent discussion):

The history of Purism shows that the company cares a lot about free software and user privacy, so Louis’ criticism of the Librem 5 phone doesn’t make any sense those grounds. The Librem 5 is the first phone that runs on 100% free software and first phone since the Golden Delicious GT04 in 2012 to have free/open source schematics. To promote the right to privacy, Purism has been using hardware kill switches in its devices since 2015, plus it created the Librem One web services and just announced the AweSIM. The idea that Purism is just doing this to make money is silly if you look at how much of a financial burden the development of the Librem 5 has caused the company. See: https://source.puri.sm/Librem5/community-wiki/-/wikis/Frequently-Asked-Questions#87-why-has-the-time-to-release-the-librem-5-increased-from-17-to-39-months

There are many reasons to criticize Purism and the Librem 5, but the specific ones that Louis mentioned are groundless in my opinion.

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For all of this wave of privacy awareness, there has been precious little concrete progress. Purism is proposing and executing on a roadmap; this is the reason that I am supporting them.

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I pointed out on r/Purism that Louis Rossmann’s specific criticisms of Purism didn’t make sense and Rossmann responded. It is worth reading.

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ahh the old smoking gun response. I don’t doubt him one bit. He seems like a pretty forward guy and I have enjoyed many of his videos.

The main character who is on record talking about some of the more unsavory elements of Purism has an obvious axe to grind.

Like Amos said, I think the actions of Purism speak louder than some of the back room conversations or decisions.

It is also a case of the cause and the people. The greater good is important, and allowing one bad decision, or apple, to ruin the lot is both unfair, and not right for the people who are doing the heavy lifting at Purism.

Everybody is so focused on the Librem 5, but all I really care about is the Librem 14.

Everyone at Purism, keep up the great work!

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I actually don’t mind if some of Puri.sm marketing plan takes advantage of the potential of a privacy minded customer base. (Note is said “some”, because there will always be other factors.) If it is good business, time will tell. Is there some sort of conflict between good and evil just because you choose your customers wisely?.

Here is an interesting mission statement from elsewhere, not puri.sm:

Our mission is to proactively leverage existing long-term, high-impact growth strategies so that we may deliver the kind of results on the bottom line that our investors expect and deserve.

I think one has to be honest, Purism is trying to build a business. In order to do so, it has to be financially viable and make money (it is one of the hard facts of life and not particularly easy to do as my experience working in a failed start-up taught me). I also would not begrudge the employees their hope to make a good living because it really is a nice thing to be able to support yourself while doing a good thing. Further, the staff could probably be making quite a nice salary working for other commercial organizations that do have the noble goal that Purism has set itself.

Of course, the quality of Purism’s products will play an important role in their success. I am waiting patiently for a phone and for the Librem 14 but I am more than willing to give them the opportunity to produce a good quality product because I think it is important.

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Well, I don’t think that’s the criticism. Rossmann’s wording implies something like “Purism sells cheap hardware for a premium by sticking some privacy buzz-words on top”.

While it’s totally possible and desirable that Purism will have a profitable business some years down the road, the idea that what they are currently doing is a scheme for quick money sounds somewhat naive or uninformed.
A lot of the decisions Purism made are the exact opposite of “the easy way”, and people constantly criticize them for that. (Why your own distro? Why not Debian on the Laptops and UBports on the phone? Why Phosh? Why only old CPUs? Why only lame 3D performance? Why not use AMD? Why not a faster Chip for the Librem 5? Why not a fully integrated chip? Yada yada yada…
The answer is always the same: Risk quite a few sales to get as close to the ideal of freedom/privacy etc. as possible. That’s not how one rides a wave.

What actually might have gone in that direction, was some of the marketing in the past, criticized by many, including me. I think it has gotten better lately. But foremost, I care about the products (hard- and software) more than about the marketing.

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VERY likely my next laptop purchase. Waiting to see how the monitor and docking station integration plays out. I would prefer to purchase everything I need at once.

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Not my particular use case, but I know what you mean. It seems poised to be able to do docking with ease!

Well - this is interesting. It is said that there are two sides to every story - His and Hers. But I say there are three sides; His, Hers and somewhere in the middle is the Truth.

Rossmann verses Purism and Friends. There will always be the Rossmanns out there drumming up Likes or ‘hits’ at the expense of others.
The giants like Google, Microsoft, Adobe, eBay, et al, look at market numbers, not individual YouTube, Instagram or Facebook and ilk.
One person speaks some nasties and the world listens. Hundreds of people expose government and corporations ignoring our right to privacy and no one notices.

Remember the trend ‘learn to be tolerant of others’? Ummm, humans - tolerant?
Another trend:
xxxx - 2018 Avoid negative people.
2019 - #### Avoid Positive people

:slight_smile:

~s~

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2020 - avoid false positive people :sweat_smile: :mask:

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Lol, know the feeling. I’m so out of touch with popular culture that every time I happen to visit someone who’s got the TV on, all I see are strangers. :joy:

If you’re gonna accuse someone of being “just some dude voicing opinions from his couch”, the least you can do is click his channel to verify this is true. It takes mere seconds to verify, and avoid false attacks on someone’s character. FYI, he does board repairs on Apple hardware, and puts the (unedited) footage of the diagnostic process and repair online so others may learn. Furthermore, he’s heavily involved in the right to repair movement (which directly affects his business). Both praiseworthy initiatives.

People can do more than one thing. Right now, I’m headed out of the door to buy me some beers for tonight. But I wouldn’t want you to characterise me as “a guy who just goes shopping for beer”; I’m not that one-dimensional. :wink:

And you would also benefit from reading previous paragraph before talking nonsense. Or at least from clicking on the link, so you’d at least know what he actually said. If you’d know anything about the man, you’d know that likes and hits are the least of his worries, and that he usually goes out of his way to remain diplomatic and to keep the possibility open that there’s another explanation. In this case he’s not willing to go deeper into it because his concerns are based on information he shouldn’t have, and he doesn’t want to betray the trust of the person who shared that information with him. But even so, he still goes out of his way to say that it’s just his opinion and he could be wrong about it.

Show me where I said I never watched his channel or explain what your rules are as to how many hours we are required to watch YOUR choice of Toobies before we are permitted to comment on without a spit-ball being tossed out from under the bridge. The only “nonsense” sir, as you call it, are your ass umptions.

‘Be tolerant of others’ wasn’t a bad idea. If you will tolerate my ‘Meh!’ for Rossmann, I will tolerate your bullish as you called it “nonsense”. Deal?

Just because I don’t like or I disagree with your Rossmann Toobie, doesn’t mean I am wrong. If it does, then there is a job waiting for you at 1600 Pennsylvania ave.

Well for that I’m sorry, I should have known better. Comment struck. Now I shall go into prayer and fasting for a couple of days.

I don’t have an issue with you not watching his channel. And indeed, nobody can reasonably expect you to sit through hours of content that doesn’t interest you. But it behooves you to at least know what you’re commenting on, which you clearly don’t. All he did was question the motives of Purism’s management, with the caveat “that’s just my opinion and I may be completely wrong about this”. Yet, the way you wrote it, it seems as if you’re under the impression that Rossman is just stirring up trouble for personal gain, when nothing could be further from the truth. That’s portraying someone in a negative light with zero arguments to justify your attack on their character. And that’s not very nice of you.

That is my issue with your post. Not that you’re not intimately familiar with literally every YouTuber out there.

Again with the assumptions. Yes, I know of Rossman. I even saw a couple of videos he made. But I’m not subscribed AFAIK, he’s far from my favourite YouTuber, and I find most of his videos too long and rambling. But sure, he’s “my Rossman Toobie”, I’m a huge fanboy, and if the swim across the pond weren’t so gosh darn inconvenient, I’d go over to camp outside his appartment until he would deign to acknowledge my presence and perhaps, if I’m really lucky, allow me to orally pleasure him as a reward for my loyalty. It’s kinda eerie how you seem able to see right through me with such accuracy… :roll_eyes:

Anyway, one can make the observation that this would also describe your initial post: someone says something slightly negative about some company/product you happen to like, and you immediately jump to conclusions about their character. Without knowing the first thing about them, and without even knowing what it was, exactly, that they said. The thought of pointing this out crossed my mind, but I see little point attacking someone’s character over a disagreement. I find it sufficient to “attack” someone’s words and actions, without jumping to conclusions about their person as a whole.

Thank you for your additional assumptions.
Take care. ~s~