Librem 5 Fir Batch

I’d like to add that for future endeavors, a preferred modem family should also be selected. There are now more options available than before but they can be finicky and need support - and instead of one single supported modem, a family line would be better. Some future proofing for “LTS phone”.

As far as I’ve kept track (which is not as extensive as some), I think the Quectel line (what was already tested via EM12-G and was preceded by EM060-GL) would be a good fit. There already exists linux support and the line (meaning here variations that use the same size and commands but have increasing features) has variants for different levels of use and price ranges. The current L5 size (which could also be made bigger to allow for current and bigger sizes) doesn’t have a full 5G card at the moment but there is new RedTop-17 spec model that may allow for upgrading to 5G already - and it seems likely there will be future models. I think this is important for the longevity but also to give options for upgrading the modem, from about 40 to 400 coins (€,$,£).

As has been seen, options in this area are needed, but they also need support to get full and perfect use, and that is why a clear choice would be good for concentration of efforts (while not excluding any other potential modems… or any other cards used in m.2 slots). Newer modems would also help a bit with battery life. I’m not aware if there are any major differences in “blobbiness”, but that should be moot, given L5 structure. 4G antennae is the minimum and alternative choices could be to include 5G regardless of modem (or even pre-emptively option for even 6G [the additional freqs at around 7Ghz, not all]) or develop a changeable back cover that has that additional antenna (but that’s theoretical and a bit iffy).

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Please improve L5 FIR.

  • Add Openmoko/NokiaN900 sim/sd socket, current it is a big shame.
  • Reduce Monitor size from 5.7 to 5.2,5,0 plus add a ‘LTPOLED 720P-HDR 90HZ, ultra power save.’ Reengineering to keep same thicker or more, nothing happens if more thinker to 5.0’
  • DO NOT get OSHWA certificate, it is not fancy and unreliable.

i.MX 8M Plus still 4k,30fps capable.

Librem 5 a GNU-LEVEL Phone made in-house by Purism. :smiley:

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What is this?

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It is an Open Source organization that certificate Open Source Hardware. As for some reason I DO NOT support anything from Opensource.

About OSHWA

The Open Source Hardware Association (OSHWA) aims to foster technological knowledge and encourage research that is accessible, collaborative and respects user freedom. OSHWA’s primary activities include hosting the annual Open Hardware Summit and maintaining the Open Source Hardware certification, which allows the community to quickly identify and represent hardware that complies with the community definition of open source hardware.

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Okay I thought something in this direction, but thanks to explain in detail. Just one further question: I know you do not support Open Source, but is it a problem to have an additional certificate? Could be a kind of advertise to catch up some people - and more sells = more money for development.

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Having that certificate as something additional is not a problem, however oshwa cert it is not mean free of blobs hardware. Most companies it using oshwa cert to make them user believe that they are free hardware of blobs.
As i am a Free Software user what i wish it is that L5 get FSF RYF Cert, which means Libre hardware in the sense Libre of BLOBs including ‘Bootloader and OS’ even without oshwa pass cert. Most oshwa hardware never go for FSF RYF which is the most important cert for real Gnu+Linux device.

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I see no issue having both certifications on the Librem 5, so Purism should acquire them towards full-stack liberation.

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There is conflict to get both cert, if so Purism will violate FSF is user harware protection rules.

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@JCS may have something to say about that.

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There is real benefit to getting OSHWA certification. I would not necessarily lump them together with the OSI organization as the certification process seems more in line with the FSF in many ways.

  1. The hardware components must use an OSI-approved license, many of which are considered free by the FSF (see https://certification.oshwa.org/process/hardware.html, https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/categories.html, and https://www.gnu.org/licenses/license-list.en.html).

    In order for your project to be OSHWA-certified, you need to attach an open source license to the hardware components. This license will provide the specific permissions and information downstream users need to make, use, remix, and build upon your work.

    1. The CERN Open Hardware License is a popular choice for licensing hardware source files and offers a strong copyleft version of the license (CERN-OHL-S v2).
    2. The FSF recommends either the GPL or CC-BY or CC-BY-SA for hardware, which would still meet the OSHWA criteria for the hardware designs.
  2. The software must also be licensed under an OSI-approved license (See https://certification.oshwa.org/process/software.html):

    In order to receive OSHWA certification, all software that is necessary for the operation of your hardware must be licensed under an OSI-approved license.

Having this OSHWA certification ensures a certain level of openness and (usually) repairability is provided. Purism has already publicly released the source files for the Librem 5 earlier, though because some of the firmware is proprietary, I would think that the Librem 5 currently would be somewhere in the middle of the certification spectrum (click “Spectrum” on the page). The FSF’s main missions focuses on software and not hardware; currently the OSHWA organization is the only one I’m aware of to push people and organizations to make their hardware open rather than proprietary.

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The FSF has historically done amazing things with FLOSS, especially with the advent of GPL, etc, but is and has always been incredibly divisive with its rhetoric. If you do not check 100/100 of FSF’s boxes, you are an antagonist and are shunned.

This is not realistic; this constant infighting harms the ethos of the community, potential adoption, and momentum of the FLOSS movement from creating something truly revolutionary.

I see FLOSS not as a binary label, but more as a number line, or a ladder. We must gradually climb the ladder to hardware/software freedom. It may not be ideal/perfect right away, but it is progress nevertheless. It is impossible to jump directly to the top of the freedom ladder, since that requires either a) a miraculous gift from big-tech, or b) an astronomical grant/investment.

If Purism approaches technology in the FSF’s preferred way, progress would be glacial and it would be many years or perhaps decades before achieving significant market share advancement. Take the Steam Deck for example. It is proprietary, yet you can see what good it has done in increasing Linux’s global market share, compatibility of gaming on Linux, enthusiasm and adoption of Linux in general… Linux being a first-class citizen in devices outside the scope of the typical FOSS/enthusiast markets.

When reaching out to investors, if Purism said “our primary competitors are System76, Tuxedo Computers, ThinkPenguin”, etc… You would see a couple hundred thousand dollars of investment, and that would net… a few months of development. You’ve got to target the large companies that have significant market share. Potential target disruption means significant investment. Yes, it’s a high-risk investment, but investments like this have created countless millionaires.

The FSF focuses primarily on software, hence the name and clear messaging up to this point in history. Purism is dedicated to climbing the freedom ladder, but this takes strategy, funding, and time. Purism strives to make the best products it can which respect the user by prioritizing freedom and security, mainlining and releasing as much hardware/gateware/firmware/software as legally possible.

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Taking a step back for perspective, there are no certifications for liberated firmware, so even if the Librem 5 acquires both the mentioned certifications, that is not enough for user freedom. RYF only addresses a small subset of firmware, mostly surrounding the CPU.

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FSF see it in the same way:
https://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/the-journey-begins-with-a-single-step-climb-the-freedom-ladder

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Thanks.
To be honest i am really disappointed with: jonathon.hall, jcs, randy.siegel by abusing evil term: FOSS, FLOSS to Gnu Pure OS. So ATM i not supporting Purism anymore, and i am going to slow down activities here to prevent be a Troll by anthogonizing Open Source. Under FLOSS, FOSS peoples it gives me a predictive estimate of the poor quality of work that is coming for L5.

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Do you have some examples you could cite of the FSF being ‘divisive?’ In my own life, I am not super strongly well informed about the FSF and mostly only read a few portions of their website.

But what I saw made me divisive (sometimes even internally divided) because it caused me to think more for myself. When I look at the FSF, what I see is that before I was born, somebody decided to make a system called GNU that already solved (or provided the option of solving) the vast majority of the worst and most horrible feeling problems that I have had with technology in my life. Then, from the moment I learned to use technology, nobody informed me about the FSF solutions and so I lived a life of being super uninformed about them, outright ignoring them, and then venting to other people in my life about the problems that arose in my lifestyle of ignorance, and pretending to fight the system which had from the moment of its inception been in violation of FSF principles that anybody could have researched online.

How is that divisive for them to post on their website, “Actually, if you follow these rules with technology, you won’t be abused,” if in fact they are right about it?

Why is that good to make people use Steam Decks? I don’t personally have one, so I am relatively uninformed about it. But if we wanted to increase “Linux market share” on Planet Earth, we could encourage people to buy more “smart TVs.” That doesn’t change the fact that people with “Smart TVs” are probably suffering somewhere deep inside, and these devices usually or always violate a small set of four rules that basically states, “actually, if you follow these rules with technology, you won’t be abused.”

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That steam was creating Proton (something like WINE, just better for games) for Steam Deck and desktop PCs. So who want to play modern games do not need to stay on Windows machines anymore. It’s one of the reasons why people leave Windows behind.

In the last 2-3 years Linux market share got doubled and is going to reach 5% world wide market share in February 2025 (if it continues this way). Steam Deck and Proton are two Reasons for this, Win11 another one.

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I got one brand new Steam deck oled edition from my brother, and i can confirm that Steam OS it is Linux+Windows. So Proton it is for Gaming Windows BLOBs. You can NOT gaming Freedom via FLOSS Steam OS. Most time windows blobs games cant booting because it need unload/upload privacy data and machine it offline. It is big Shame, it is big Foss.

ATM my kids it using for Forza Horizon 4,5 but really hard to use. ‘FLOSS a Trojan’.

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I never spoke about it’s FOSS - in fact, most games are proprietary, especially those who are enabled on Linux via Proton. DRM, Kernel-Level-Anticheat and other bad technologies are also included (depending on the individual game). However, it’s still better to play it on Linux than doing it on Windows. If you are a gamer, you have no other choice right now.

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Please, Please wake up Purism. Make Librem 5 TRULY Librem 5 by 5.0’.
Librem 5 a Gnu homemade device by Purism! :cowboy_hat_face:
F I R

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