Why Purism is the shittest company ever and why they deleted my previous topic? Please share before it will be deleted

Hardware
18

With all respect to author of this thread.

Know your rights.
nothing stops you from issuing “charge back” procedure in your bank to get money back.
FYI: charge back is part of Card Companies policy to protect users from scam.
when you open it, it will be a purism problem to prove that they fulfill order, otherwise guilty as charged.
you will get your money.

however spamming forums with frustration… it’s not an way of solving things.
i agree that purism shop terms and conditions are not fully OK, especially in context of order cancellation, however you clicked agree on them, otherwise you wouldn’t be able to make order.

i was in similar position like you some time ago - ordered in march 2020 , and opened refund request, but i decided to wait for my order be ready to ship and then resign…
i changed my mind in a moment when got notification that my L14 is ready.
And today after a month with that laptop i can say it was worth wait.

anyway. oyu have to understand purism is a small company made mostly by technology and privacy enthusiasts. they don’t have resources like dell/apple to press suppliers - no laverage point.
ask your self a questions - how many units can be in batch? 1k? maybe 2k?
why? simple, they have to pay for hardware before they will sell it…

i am pretty sure there is no bad will within a purism. they try to build devices without taking loans…

about your agressive posts. hell yeah they need to be deleted!!! not because you are showing your frustration, because how you are doing that.
i was thinking i am troll when i was shooting to company for “nasty hotfix” on board…
well my messages had constructive impact and never got deleted.
your don’t have anything constructive.
you wish get your money back ?! sure go to your bank and submit charge back… it takes 10 minutes you will get money within a 14 days.

So stop behaving like f*ing kid, and use your brain.
Instead of playing troll and spamming forum with your frustration, get your money back from bank.

3 Likes
19

The thing is, many people here seem to expect a daily or weekly update on a situation that may not even be possible to update yet, because Purism doesn’t have any new information at all. It’s the equivalent of “Are we there yet? Are we there yet? When will we get there?” from the kids in the back seat of the car.

They can’t have any new information because everything’s disrupted, they don’t own their suppliers, and their suppliers can only make estimates at the moment anyway, which means Purism can only give estimates, which they have already done.

Besides, every time Purism publishes an estimated timeline, people here latch onto it as if it were a legally-binding contract.

The frustration of not knowing and not having a product you ordered long ago is completely understandable, and if you now have doubts about why you decided to support this important project in the first place, or if your financial situation has changed, then by all means take action to extricate yourselves. But berating and accusing Purism is not the way to go about it.

7 Likes
20

My understanding was that Purism were going to give monthly updates? At any rate I wouldn’t expect daily or weekly updates, but statements reaffirming that things are still on track would reassure a lot of people.

This fire is going well enough as it is without more being added, but seriously, inferring that their communication is ok is hard to defend.

21

Yes, except that currently no phones can be shipped until October, so which exactly monthly updates do you expect?

22

There is a science named “Risk management”. If Purism and you - @amarok are not aware of it go and be familiar with it first and then start to talk (or doing the business). If Purism failed with some parts of his business that is the problem of their management not the customer (or investors). I hope that made it clear to you. No investor will invest to such company with such poor management.

23

Actually, it is our problem as customers, because if Purism fails and goes out of business, then there isn’t another company that is going to replace its products or pick up its development work.

Although the HP Spectre 360 has a kill switch for the webcam and several Thinkpads have sliding shutters over their webcams, Purism is the only company that makes laptops with comprehensive hardware kill switches (webcam, microphone, WiFi and Bluetooth). Purism maintains the leading 100% free software distro (according to distrowatch.org’s rankings), and is the only company making new laptops that publicly aligns with the goals of the FSF.

Of the roughly 3 dozen Linux hardware companies in the world, there are only 4 that I know of which pay for any software development (Purism, System76, Raspberry Pi Foundation and Google). System76 and Raspberry Pi F. maintain their own distros and they develop FOSS code for their own hardware (like ec and raspi-config), but only Purism and Google are contributing code that isn’t specific to their hardware, such as Linux graphical user interfaces and user applications.

Purism managed to raise $2.05 million in convertible notes over the last 37 days, so clearly there are some investors who see value in the company. (The web page currently lists $4.55M, but it started with $2.5 million, which I presume was the $2.5M that Purism raised in December 2019.)

I assume that investors look at it this way: There’s about 20 companies currently selling Linux laptops (not including Chromebooks), but there are only 6 companies that custom design their Linux laptops (Purism, Dell, Lenovo, Star Labs, PINE64 and OLIMEX). There are only two that maintain their own Linux distros (Purism and System76), only three that offer new laptops with Coreboot preinstalled (Purism, System76 and Star Labs), only two that offer Heads and verifiable boot (Purism and NitroKey), only two that do any software development (Purism and System76), and only one that offers hardware kill switches (Purism) and only two that offer anti-interdiction services (Purism and NitroKey). When looking at the Linux phone market, there are 6 companies selling Linux phones (Purism, PINE64, Hallo Welt Systeme (Volla Phone), F(x)tec, jolla-devices.com and Planet Computers), but 2 of those are installing Linux in existing phones (Hallo Welt Systeme and jolla-devices.com). Only 2 offer only Linux and are fully committed to it (Purism and PINE64), only 2 run on Linux drivers (Purism and PINE64), only 2 are aiming to eventually use a standard Linux kernel (Purism and PINE64) and only 1 does any software development (Purism).

Given the growing demand for user-verifiable security, privacy and Linux devices in general, there is logic to investing in Purism despite its production problems, because it is doing so much more than other Linux companies.

5 Likes
24

It is not the problem of the customers why Purism fails. It is the problem of their (mis)management Thats all. If Purism fails, it fails. We can do nothing here as a customers. Also the fact they are doing some work on privacy stuff does not make them reliable partner. Do you understand? The first and foremost thing here is the TRUST (and reliability). Purism does not prove itself as a reliable partner.

25

It seems like you’ve had problems with getting messages deleted. Instead of going to Reddit maybe you could try LibremSocial? Or Mastodon. It would be interesting to see how those work with censoring. Just a suggestion. I understand that you’re frustrated. Luckily I received my L5 before the delivery problems.

26

If you received your L5 before the delivery problems then you simply can not understand me.

27

My hope is that the extra funds that Purism recently raised will allow it to refund customers like you who cancelled their orders. However, you should take the time to consider the importance of Purism’s dev work and how we as a community benefit from it.

Purism’s Matt DeVillier has made 477 commits to Coreboot and people who use Coreboot rely on his web page to get the latest firmware for their devices.

Purism was the first company to sell PCs with the Intel Management Engine disabled and the first to sell non-Chromebooks with Coreboot preinstalled and the first to use Heads, and its example pressured the other Linux laptop sellers to start copying it. If Purism hadn’t done it first, I doubt that System76 and Star Labs would be selling Coreboot laptops today, NitroKey would be selling a Heads laptop, and Think Penguin, TUXEDO Computers, System76 and Star Labs would be disabling the Intel Management Engine today.

Purism’s work on libhandy and libadwaita is giving GTK/GNOME software a responsive interface, so it can dynamically adjust to the screen size and better support touch interfaces.

Frankly, the future of mobile Linux depends on Purism. See the FAQ Why did Purism decide to create the new Phosh interface and my blog post on the Strategic Advantages of Phosh for Mobile Linux. There is a reason why 70% of PinePhone users say that they use Phosh and 56% say that Phosh is their favorite interface. Ubuntu Touch doesn’t have enough volunteers to properly maintain it, Sailfish OS will never attract community support due to its proprietary Silica interface, and Plasma Mobile is developing much slower than Phosh and doesn’t have any corporate support.

Having watched LibreBox, ZaReason and Station X recently go out of business and watching Libiquity give up development of ProteanOS and Minifree/RetroFreedom stop selling for most of last year, it is clear to me that it is hard for Linux PC sellers to stay in business.

After watching company after company give up on Linux phones, it is frankly a minor miracle that Purism got the Librem 5 to market. It is much easier to buy a phone from Gigaset and install Ubuntu Touch, which is what Volla Phone is doing, or to buy base laptop models from Clevo and slap in a distro made by someone else, which is what most Linux laptops are. In contrast, Purism is doing custom hardware and custom software development with the L14 and L5 and trying to produce those products in the middle of a global chip shortage.

4 Likes
28

Whatever you wrote is nice. But what if the company does not respond to my cancelling requests?

29

Purism’s stated policy is that it refunds orders when it gets to your order in the queue. At this point, Purism should have gotten to your order in the queue, so you have a legitimate complaint, and you should publicize that fact on public forums.

As I said before, I am hopeful that Purism’s recent fund-raising means that Purism will be able to repay cancelled orders for the L14 and L5, so this situation can be resolved. @Benko did eventually get his refund after many months.

1 Like
30

Being hopeful does not solve the actual problem. What me to do in fact? I write emails but got no responces. What to do?

31

Read my post and it clearly says what I expect. Communication is letting Purism down. As I said, even communicating that things are on track as previously explained to reassure people, I feel, is important.
How hard can it be for the hardcore supporters that will back Purism no matter what, to understand that this void of silence, not to mention dodgy refund policies, is where all of this comes from?

32

i told you already what to do.
stop whining, call your bank issue “Charge back” for transaction.
it’s simple, you will get your money back within 7-14 days - depend on the bank.
case closed.
posting on forum instead of doing actual move to get money back proves only you are a typical millennial seeking for attention.

33

What in the hell I need your attention?

34

well , you are complaining , that you can’t get your money back.
i pointed you 3rd time how to get this money back even if Purism will oppose.
pointed you even link to campaign about Cargeback…
instead using it, you are burning energy to spamming forum with your frustration…
so, what is your goal?!

other than pissing people and proving you are not smart enough to use elemental right that been given to your creadit/debit card issuer

EDIT: lack of answer to your emails will work in your advantage…
trust me i used chargeback in many occasions.

it’s 1 phone call to bank + one email with attached of proof of the order + attached emails about company didn’t fulfill your order, and do not wish to give you your money back.

trick is , for bank seller have to prove is innocent, guilty as charged until prove that order been sent and goods are matching order…

that will work much better than whining on this forum xD

35

If you are so smart please let me know what is the chargeback limit in days from the day of purchase?

1 Like
36

depends on card issuer: Mastercard/Visa 540 days , Amex other i do not know, but it’s easy to call bank and ask
however you did preorder with date pointed, you should find in archive.org proof that “ships on XXX” date start then, not when you paid. (trick lernt with different preorder i was forced to cancel elsewere.
so i always take screenshot when i do such preorder :wink:

37

I think you are misinformed it is 120 days not 540